The title of this recording is "Law reform in New Zealand". It is described as: Dr Alison Laurie talks about homosexual law reform in New Zealand. It was recorded in Wellington, Aotearoa New Zealand on the 12th January 2011. Alison Laurie is presenting.  Their name is spelt correctly but may appear incorrectly spelt later in the document. The duration of the recording is 16 minutes, but this may not reflect the actual length of the proceedings. A list of correctly spelt content keywords and tags can be found at the end of this document. A brief description of the recording is: In this podcast Alison talks about homosexual law reform in New Zealand. The content in the recording covers the 1970s decade. A brief summary of the recording is: In the podcast titled "Law reform in New Zealand," presented by Alison Laurie and recorded on January 12, 2011, in Wellington, New Zealand, the speaker discusses the historical efforts for homosexual law reform in New Zealand during the 1970s. The summary encapsulates the key themes and efforts recounted by Laurie, especially focusing on legislative attempts, public activism, and the sociopolitical climate of that era. The New Zealand Homosexual Law Reform Society, established in 1967, played a pivotal role in advocating legal changes to decriminalize male homosexual acts. A reform-focused petition signed by 75 notable figures was presented to Parliament in 1968. Despite these efforts, an initial bill proposed by Venn Young was defeated in 1975 due to a harmful amendment suggested by Gerald Wall which could have criminalized the promotion of homosexuality as normal to those under 20. The establishment of the National Gay Rights Coalition of New Zealand (NGRC) in 1977 marked a significant watershed in collective activism. The NGRC, which was a conglomerate of multiple groups, was responsible for issuing the influential "Pink Triangle" newspaper and agitated for wider social acceptance and legal equity. Despite these mobilizations, complex challenges arose, such as conflict over the age of consent. Warren Freer's proposition for an age of consent of 20 years, later adjusted to 18, was met with resistance by the NGRC, which stressed the necessity for parity with heterosexual age of consent laws. A division occurred within the movement as some members believed this legislative change to be adequate while others insisted on complete parity. Fran Wilde, a Labour Member of Parliament from Wellington, initially considered introducing a gender-neutral bill to decriminalize male homosexual acts but retracted the approach after protests by lesbian organizations that highlighted the risks of inadvertently criminalizing young lesbians due to age of consent uncertainties. In 1984, discussions among the Auckland Gay Task Force, Christchurch Gay Task Force, and Fran Wilde shaped a bill with a more universal support. The electoral success of the fourth Labour Government in the same year coincided with the formation of the Ministry of Women's Affairs and raised concerns about the potential backlash from conservative and fundamentalist groups. Despite attempts at secrecy to preempt oppositional campaigning, when the Homosexual Law Reform Bill was introduced in 1985, it provoked an immediate and vehement counter-campaign, led by Norm Jones and other MPs, in cahoots with fundamentalist figures like Sir Keith Hay. An aggressive petition against the bill prompted extensive mobilization and strategic responses from the gay and lesbian task forces, such as humor-centric campaigning and public demonstrations, which proved to be critical for morale and for garnering public support. Eventually, the Homosexual Law Reform Bill passed in July 1986, decriminalizing male homosexuality with a non-discriminatory age of consent set at 16. While Part 2, concerning the amendment to the Human Rights Commission Act, was abandoned due to diminishing utility from multiple restrictions, Part 1 marked the end of the criminalization of male homosexual acts in New Zealand. The full transcription of the recording follows.  It includes timestamps every thirty seconds in the format [HH:MM:SS].  The transcription begins:  This transcript has been lightly edited for clarity Hi, I'm Dr Alison Laurie. I was the Gender and Women's Studies Programme Director at Victoria University at Wellington, here in New Zealand, for many years. I'm a writer, oral historian and lesbian and gay activist. Today I'm going to be looking at Homosexual Law Reform in New Zealand and how this was achieved. The New Zealand Homosexual Law Reform Society was formed in 1967 and it was dedicated to urging a change in the law regarding male homosexual acts. The Society presented a petition to Parliament urging Homosexual Law Reform, signed by 75 prominent people, in 1968, and in 1974 the National Member of Parliament for Egmont, Venn Young, put forward a private members' bill intending to amend the Crimes Act of 1961, which proposed the decriminalization of private homosexual acts between consenting males over the age of 21 years. Following the proposed Wall Amendment by Labour Member of Parliament for Porirua, Gerald Wall, the bill was defeated because Gerald Wall put forward an amendment which, although it supported the decriminalization it sought to criminalize all public comment made to persons under 20 which implied that homosexuality was normal. So fortunately the bill was defeated at its Second Reading in 1975. And the lesbian and gay organizations which had formed as a result of gay liberation and lesbian feminism, from about 1972, very strongly campaigned against the bill because of that amendment. But that was the first attempt that came about trying to create legislative change. In 1977 something very important happened, which was that the National Gay Rights Coalition of New Zealand, the NGRC, which was an umbrella organization for lesbian and gay groups, formed, and that was a coalition of groups. At one stage there's something like 33 groups. The NGRC puts out a newspaper called The Pink Triangle, and it's hugely influential and is very committed not only to legal change but also into improving circumstances, creating social change and enabling lesbians and gay men to be out and to live their lives as they would like to do. The NGRC is very interested in the Human Rights Commission Act, which was passed in 1977, and it included several grounds on which discrimination against people were outlawed, but it didn't include sexual orientation, and that was something which the NGRC became very interested in and remained so for a number of years. It's interesting that in 1978, the year after the NGRC forms, they support Dr Ian Scott who stood in the Eden electorate, Auckland, as the Labour Party's first openly gay candidate. He wasn't successful. He's not the first person – openly gay candidate – standing for Parliament however, because as early as 1975 Robin Duff had stood in the General Election for the Values Party as the very first openly gay candidate. Neither of these candidates were, at that stage, successful. Now, in 1979 another Labour Member of Parliament, Warren Freer, proposed amendments to the Crimes Act and also trying to decriminalize male homosexual acts. He wanted an age of consent of 20 years, and this was immediately opposed by the National Gay Rights Coalition because of the unequal age of consent with heterosexual acts. So already we can see a great change in consciousness; that it's not enough to have decriminalization if it isn't equal. If heterosexual sex acts are legal at the age of 16, well, so should homosexual acts be. We can't have a situation of inequality; it sends a bad message to society. The more conservative groups within the NGRC are rather alarmed about this. Some of the men in the Dorian Society are concerned about it. They'd much rather see decriminalization at any age. But the British experience bothers people: that that went through with an unequal age of consent and there hasn't been any movement in it. So, the whole younger generation certainly do not want to see an unequal age of consent. Warren Freer proposed a new amendment in 1980 with an age of consent of 18, and that was again opposed by the NGRC, and it was dropped. And that certainly created a split in the NGRC which really starts to collapse after then because of conflicts. Many of the conservative groups really think that 18 would have been fine, and they start to talk about the "all or nothing brigade" who torpedo any kind of legislative reform. Then in 1983 Fran Wilde, who has just entered Parliament, she's the Labour Member of Parliament for Wellington, and she considers introducing a gender-neutral private members' bill decriminalizing male homosexual acts, and this is the so-called Equality Bill. She doesn't proceed because lesbians strongly oppose any such legislation on the grounds that if something went wrong with the age of consent then you'd end up with lesbians, perhaps between the ages of 18 and 20 or between whatever, finding themselves criminalized, and that it's too uncertain to consider that introducing a gender-neutral act would be any kind of a good idea because too many things could go wrong. What's interesting about that is that lesbian groups lobby other women members of Parliament who immediately see that that would be a foolish idea, so they lobby Fran Wilde and that's dropped. Once again, this campaign does create ill feeling between men, particularly gay men in Auckland who thought this would be a good idea and the more radical gay men in Wellington who support the lesbian groups in thinking that that isn't the way to go. However, in 1984 Fran Wilde begins to have discussions with Gay Task Force members in Wellington to discuss what kind of act would be acceptable, would get a wide support for it, and there's a good deal of input into what this kind of bill ought to look like. The Auckland Gay Task Force and the Christchurch Gay Task Force are formed in November, 1984, and they too begin to have discussions with Fran Wilde. Now, the election of the fourth Labour Government in 1984, which is when Fran Wilde comes to Parliament, brought about the establishment of the Ministry of Women's Affairs. And prior to setting up this new ministry, the government had held women's forums throughout the country which lesbians attended, and many women were alarmed by the presence of busloads of Christian fundamentalist women who carried Bibles and copies of the National Anthem, and who voted against abortion, lesbian rights and also against ratifying the United Nations Convention on the elimination of the discrimination against women. Lesbians suggested to the Gay Task Force that fundamentalists might campaign against Homosexual Law Reform, but most of the men thought that organizing against abortion or women's equality didn't indicate that fundamentalists would necessarily campaign against homosexuality. And the Gay Task Force really was not particularly well organized at the time of the introduction of the bill. Greater effort had been put into the shape of the bill. It was going to be:Part I – To decriminalize all homosexual acts between consenting males in private, with anage of consent of 16 years; an equal age of consent. And also Part 2 – To add sexual orientation as an amendment to the Human RightsCommission Act. The bill was drawn up by Wellington Gay Task Force activist Ewen Painter at a community meeting with Fran Wilde, and it was based on various drafts by the Auckland and Wellington groups. Fran Wilde thought the bill would have a greater chance of success if strict secrecy was observed, and she didn't think the bill should be publicized. And she thought that it would just be a short Parliamentary campaign, perhaps of about three months, for what would be a private members' bill, and the Gay Task Force agreed to this. And in retrospect it's difficult to know whether more damage was done because of the lack of preparation and involvement of groups throughout the country, or whether, if there had been an early organization then news of the bill might have reached the opponents, which would have enabled them to campaign against it. In retrospect you can't really know that. Whatever, the introduction of the bill on the 8th of March, 1985, was carried by 51 to 24 votes. But opposition to it was immediately mobilized by various members of Parliament: Norm Jones, who was a National Member for Invercargill; Jeff Braybrooke, a Labour Member for Napier; Graham Lee, a National Member for Hauraki; and Allan Wallbank, Labour from Gisborne. Before the first week had ended these people had launched a nationwide petition against the bill with a fundamentalist Christian businessman, Sir Keith Hay, who claimed to be just a carpenter doing God's work, and Sir Peter Tait, from Napier, as chief petitioners. On March 20th the Salvation Army announced that it would take the petition door to door. And this petition against Homosexual Law Reform, and using very strong scare-mongering tactics, was circulated through schools, workplaces, prisons, rest homes and churches, with stands being set up in the streets. It eventually claimed 835,000 signatures against the bill were collected, and the petition was presented to Parliament on the 24th of September, 1985. And the campaign was really a very difficult one. It was very necessary. The Gay Task Force and various gay and lesbian organizations fought very hard. We were starting late to get the organization going. We organized street marches, we organized protests, in town halls we attended meetings of those against the bill, and so forth. We held pickets outside the Salvation Army. We tried to create a campaign which created a lot of laughter because we felt that the situation was so stressful that unless you introduced certain laughter and things of that sort into it, light-hearted things such as, for example, taking balloons on the marches and doing a lot of singing and making a lot of jokes, that unless you did that you could actually be getting into a situation where street violence could have occurred, there might have been some bad clashes. And certainly I think that that's a good model if you have that kind of opposition that are really nasty, very serious, and it gets to that kind of point. You have to be very careful as to how you determine what tactics you'll use against them because if you get a mob against you you're going to lose, so the best way is if you can mock your protagonists. And of course we have in our communities, in our lesbian and gay communities, a strong tradition of humor, as have many other oppressed communities. The Jewish community, for example, have always used humor. So, humor is one of the best tactics. We had a lot of comical songs that we sang: things about ripping up petitions and that sort of thing. And in many respects, a lot of those actions made people feel better about themselves. It was very good morally for our own communities. Some people were getting very depressed, especially if some gay and lesbian people had, themselves, signed the petition because they didn't have an alternative when it was brought into their workplace unless they wanted to immediately come out. When the suggestion is: Oh well, unless you're a poofter, you know, you'll sign this. So people did sign and then felt terrible about it. There were suicides; people were depressed, so it was good to have a campaign which raised people's morale as well as actually creating a better kind of public opinion. That won a lot of public support. And the other thing that was important were the mistakes made by the people against the bill, and that was that they brought in American advisors against the bill and they had something that looked a bit like the Nuremberg Rally at Parliament, where they carried the petition up in boxes and they all sang the National Anthem, and they'd actually brought John Swan and various people like this and paid them a lot of money to come from the United States and advise them to do this. And the average New Zealander, when they saw this happening on their television screens thought: God! We don't want anything to do with this. It looks like the Nuremberg Rally. So that worked very much against them, which worked in our favor. The bill was considered by the Statutes Revision Committee, which received a lot of submissions, nearly 1,000 submissions, and by October, 1985, it reported back and the Second Reading of the bill began, starting from March, 1986, and it was eventually passed. Part 2 of the bill was lost, which was the human rights part, and that was good that it was lost because so many amendments had been put forward to that that it would apply except for the police, except for teachers, and so on, that it wasn't worth having. So, the good thing was that Part 1 of the bill was passed through all of its stages. The Third Reading was on the 9th of July, 1986, and finally on that date the Homosexual Law Reform Bill, Part 1, decriminalizing male homosexuality with an age of consent of 16, was passed by 49 to 44 votes. And almost all the National Members of Parliament voted against the bill, with an exception of George Gair who disagreed with the age of consent of 16 but said he thought change was inevitable, and he voted for the bill. And on the 11th of July, the Homosexual Law Reform Act, 1986, was signed into law by the Governor General and it came into effect on the 8th of August, which ended all those years of the criminalization of male homosexual acts in Aotearoa / New Zealand. Transcript by cyberscrivener. com The full transcription of the recording ends. A list of keywords/tags describing the recording follow. These tags contain the correct spellings of names and places which may have been incorrectly spelt earlier in the document. The tags are seperated by a semi-colon: 1970s ; Alison Laurie ; Auckland ; Fran Wilde ; Gay Liberation Front ; Gay Line Wellington Trust ; Gay Task Force ; General election ; Gerald Wall ; Gisborne ; God ; Heterosexuals Unafraid of Gays (HUG) ; Homosexual Law Reform ; Homosexual Law Reform Society ; Human Rights Commission ; Ian Scott ; Invercargill ; Jewish community ; Member of Parliament ; Napier ; National Gay Rights Coalition ; Nuremberg Rally ; People ; Queer History 101 ; Robin Duff ; Rule Foundation ; Salvation Army ; United Nations ; Warren Freer ; Wellington ; Wellington Gay Task Force ; abortion ; accountability ; actions ; activism ; age of consent ; army ; balloons ; boxes ; change ; community ; consent ; conservative ; discrimination ; equality ; farewell ; feminism ; gaming ; gay ; gay liberation movement ; gender ; gender neutral ; government ; hate speech ; heterosexual ; hit ; homophobia ; homosexual ; homosexual law reform ; human rights ; inequality ; laughter ; legislation ; lesbian ; lesbian feminism ; liberation ; love ; march ; meetings ; mistakes ; mock ; news ; normal ; other ; petition ; politics ; public opinion ; rally ; reading ; select committee ; sex ; sexual orientation ; singing ; social ; social change ; speech ; success ; support ; tactics ; time ; tradition ; transcript online ; trust ; university ; violence ; women ; women's studies ; work. The original recording can be heard at this website https://www.pridenz.com/queer_history_law_reform.html. The master recording is also archived at the Alexander Turnbull Library in Wellington, New Zealand.  For more details visit their website https://tiaki.natlib.govt.nz/#details=ecatalogue.1089358. Alison Laurie also features audibly in the following recordings: "Alison Laurie profile", "Legal background for LGBT communities", "Early lesbian and gay groups", "Hagley Park killing", "Gay Liberation", "Human rights and civil unions", "Frances Hodgkins", "Parker and Hulme murder case", "Meeting places", "Labels", "Katherine Mansfield", "Lesbian organising", "Ursula Bethell", "Alison Laurie - KAHA Youth Hui 2009", "25th anniversary panel discussion on homosexual law reform", "Alison Laurie - Bigot Busters rally", "Criminal cases", "Rainbow Pride Community Honours (2015) - Part 3", "Part 1 - Opening ceremony at Parliament - Wellington Pride Festival 2016" and "Stonewall 25". Please note that this document may contain errors or omissions - you should always refer back to the original recording to confirm content.