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Before reality shows like MasterChef had even been thought of New Zealand's own Hudson and halls, whipping up very questionable cooking and making audiences around the country laugh. Considered Trail Blazers at the time. Peter Hudson and David Halls. Also the original Great gay love story. At a time when most homosexual couples kept their relationships very quiet, KK Chapman and Chris Parker bring the would be GMOs to life again with the Silo Theatre Show Hudson and Halls Live opening at Hannah Playhouse in Wellington Tonight, [00:00:30] the duo will be up to their elbows and turkey stuffing as they take the audience back to an eighties TV show. Uh, for an eighties TV set rather for opening night music a certain style always present in Hudson and halls If I could We all and see you [00:01:00] I love the secrets, things you try. It's like if I could see, not stand mean of all the things you see Yeah, question and for me, [00:01:30] yeah, [00:02:00] you, bye to we are right. And what, um, it's only me [00:02:30] will understand all the things you see this question. So [00:03:00] [00:03:30] [00:04:00] Tina Cross with a song from the show Hunter and Halls live, joining me Now. Kip Chapman and Chris Parker didn't know who to call the actor. And who's the writer? Kip. You were the original, weren't you? The writer? The writer? Yes, a lot of the dialogue in a lot of improv and rehearsals, that's for sure, Trying to work it all out. There's a lot of there's a lot of stage admin, a lot of pots, hot pots that [00:04:30] K just wrote whatever he wanted to. And then we had to organise it all because it didn't really line up. Yeah, and you're never quite sure you've got and you've got to make the mistakes work. So there was a lot of improvisation during the rehearsals that sort of found its way into the show. So, you know, this is a sort of show that probably evolves. It goes on, Would you say Yeah, absolutely. And this is an immersive show. So we're acknowledging that the audience is there like we said it in a 19 eighties TV studio. So the audience members are kind of immersed [00:05:00] in this TV studio world. And so if an audience member, um, see something, we're gonna react to it. And so we're really interested in blurring the lines between the audience and the performers. So, yeah, it's a it's a really a live experience. How many episodes did you watch? Well, it's really There are so few episodes out there because from the archives it was all done on VHS. And they just dubbed over it because I just watched something a few minutes ago and everything was there, apart from the musical items by the guests, which [00:05:30] I guess they didn't have the rights to put out. Yes, that's that one on NZ on screen. I've watched that one about 30 times. Have you tried to emulate to any great extent, Chris in terms of your mannerisms? Absolutely. That's 100%. The job of this show is for the actor. It's to kind of I mean, there's that kind of bringing the emotional intensity of the of their relationship. But also you have to hit that nostalgia for the audience. So it's about getting the speech impediment that he had the mannerisms, the voice. So I played David [00:06:00] halls, and so he kind of talks like he's got this sort of lip here, and it's kind of Cockney. But he's also quite formal as well, so he kind of slips between these modes. He was He was English. Yes, they lived here for moved here to design shoes. They they set up a shoe store. Julius Garfinkel was that that was in the arcade. And, of course, it was Queens Arcade Queens, and it didn't mean anything. Julius. I think they just like the name. That's where he met Peter. He was back in New Zealand [00:06:30] as a shoe designer, and then he met Peter, and then they started a shop together. And what was Pete like? Uh, well, Peter sort of talked like this, and Peter, I think, would like to have been seen as the more responsible member of the team. But it's from a wealthy side of Melbourne, so they kind of have that sort of RP sort of, you know, and but was very secretive about his past. Like, we've spoken to lots of their friends, um, over the last couple of years, as we've been developing the show and showing it, and most [00:07:00] of them have no idea about Peter's past, and we really couldn't find out that much. I mean, did you worry about that or did you just try and use a dramatic licence? Well, kind of like what we did with Apollo 13. Like we're theatre makers. Our job is to explore feelings and show feelings on stage. Our job isn't to of the Wikipedia entry of who Peter and David are. Our job is to go. This was their vibe. This is what it felt like to be around them. But his personality type because he didn't want to reveal who he was, tells you quite a lot about him. Yeah, [00:07:30] it's quite interesting when I was working with Coin Holloway on the Voice recently and Cohen was able to delve straight into it and said, Oh, he he keeps a lot of secrets, doesn't he? When he was watching this episode, and even by keeping the secrets, Cohen said, Well, that's how you'd hold your body and by holding your body. That's how the voice comes out. So everything is completely connected. And I think watching my kind of weigh in was watching the episode over just the same episode over and over again and kind of obsessing over it, getting really deep [00:08:00] into it, and you begin to see the relationship in a new way in terms of how they worked on camera together. So all the sniping was that for the audience, for the well, some of it is. And then there's a difference. There's the ones that they know are fun as funny. And there's their brand, that kind of bickering in the kitchen. And then there's a few digs which are just dig a little bit deeper. And that's kind of the love in their relationship coming through. But a dominance in the relationship as well from one or the other. I think they both gave as good as they got. I mean, [00:08:30] our our show is super camp unashamedly camp really fun. And when we put it on, we were a little bit nervous. Oh my God, have we gone too far? But all their friends, like we've met um, David's goddaughter. We've met some of Peter and David's best friends of the show, and the one note we kept getting back when we did our season last year was you haven't gone far enough. That was actually bigger than that. I have to say The feedback I've had from friends at Auckland was a lot of the older gay community were furious and hated [00:09:00] it. Others who weren't involved so much in the gay community got the humour. What's your reaction to that? And why do you think that some people might have some men of a certain age, particularly? May have reacted that way. Look, I, I can't speak for them all I can say. Do you have any of that feedback at the time? Um, look, a few A few people walked out, but I didn't hear any hear anything from them. All I can say is we're coming from a point of view of celebration. Chris and I are both gay men. My husband, [00:09:30] who conceived the show, is a gay man and looking at Peter and David, they are heroes. But your generation is so different. You've grown up in a period where nothing in terms of sexual relationships is illegal. Whereas when uh, Hunt and Hall were making the show was still illegal. Well, it was illegal when I grew up. It was illegal until 1986 And so, at the age of six, when sexuality is beginning in a child, it was, but you need to live with it as an adult. That's what I'm saying. Well, we still we still live against resistance on a daily basis. I mean, you just had to look at Brian [00:10:00] Tamaki yesterday to be like it's still going. I mean, no, I mean, it's different for everyone. It's in different points in their life. But I think as well it's really important to acknowledge the fact that we're also reintroducing these people to a whole new generation of people who never met them. And this is not a criticism. This is just me thinking, Well, you know, if you grew up in the 19 fifties or sixties and you, um you know, had to fight for your rights, I did grow up. I did grow up. You know, I was 22 when I came out, and the reason why I didn't come out was because it wasn't socially acceptable at the time. [00:10:30] So I came up when I was 22. That was in 2002, and 2004 was when, um, civil unions were introduced. I was on the lawn of Parliament going, Oh my God, we've actually got some rights But it was, but it was a separate but equal law. It wasn't until 10 years later, when marriage was made legal. I got married year to my husband. That's I've been part of this journey. And these guys, you know, 30 years ago were were at the absolute cutting edge of that fight. What do you think of their relationship? [00:11:00] Um, in terms of why they made it so public was that you know them as a political statement, or was it just because of who they were that they didn't like to hide reality? I don't think it was political at all because they never really fought for the politics of being gay. I think what their fight was was against the blandness and the beige of New Zealand culture. And I think that's why this story is so important. Today we live in a culture where our national colour is black, like everyone just wears black puffer jackets. [00:11:30] Look, if you if you look at them, you know cumber buns the complete opposite. And it's like, thank God we have people like riding around and, you know, they completely unlicensed, just going just living their life to their fullest. And I think like I look at them and I, I am inspired by it. And I think you sort of think like you're carving your own way. But you actually acknowledge that someone's already done that for you. And these two men have, in a way, sort of carved a path for me in order to live my life to my fullest because you think people [00:12:00] laugh with them or, um, is it a I think there's in our in our show. Hopefully, it's celebratory, and I know that the audience this could be, you know, this is exactly what happened in the episode I was watching. I think when things get absolutely terrible, yeah, and we have cooking spilling all across the table. I think in terms of whether they are laughing with [00:12:30] us or at us, and this is something I feel quite strongly about is the style of camp. And I think it's an empowered art form that, um, some people like to think that it's kind of a A, and this is kind of New Zealand's sort of manly, sort of over the top, very queenly, sort of lots of bitchiness. That sort of camp is a style like it. It is a style. It's a performance style. Graham Norton plays to it. He turns it up, and it is empowered. It's a choice for that performer. They had those innate qualities in them, but they turn [00:13:00] it up. So was there much conversation when you originally put the show together about that camping style and how you would use it today? I don't think there was any getting away from that. I think that was just It's so innate in their personalities that that's the only way you can camp for the television as well. There's a choice. People would love it. I. I turned up my camp on stage because I knew. I know people like it and I like giving it. It's not. It's nothing. I'm ashamed of the depth of the relationship. [00:13:30] I mean, these two guys, they moved to back to England. Um, and the show was picked up by BBC. I think, um, they were together the you know, the big part of their lives. And when um, one of the guys got cancer, who was it who was sick? Peter died of cancer at about the age of 62 and took his own life less than two years later. Yeah, I think 14 months later. And can you imagine not being able to talk in public because he was interviewed many times after the death of Peter not being able to say my lover of 30 [00:14:00] years, my partner, my soulmate. So how did he refer to uh oh, I think they I think I watched one terrible interview where they said, Oh, your friend passed away this year and I mean, that is just makes my skin crawl. And so you can imagine how hard that must have been for David. It's just yeah, dreadful. We're talking to Kip Chapman and Chris Parker about their show, Hunter and Hall's live, which is everything but sad. Yeah, because I mean, you haven't really gone into that side of it. [00:14:30] This is about doing a show live on stage, as they did it live for them the way we celebrate them, As you know, it's not. This isn't a kind of museum piece. This is like we're we're bringing the life back. We're kind of reintroducing them the way that the country saw them, which is through this outrageous cooking show that was on television. These men were like kind of making cream cheese soups while drinking a champagne with the other hand. You know, while also bickering with each other there, there's kind of nothing like it. And when you watch it on NZ on screen and [00:15:00] then on the stage, you you hardly believe that it happened. But it did, and it was that big. Do you think they would have scripted anything when they made their shows? Apparently they scripted nothing but what they did the day before the episode, they'd They'd bring the floor manager around to their house, where they'd perform the show in front of the floor manager whilst drinking heavily, and then the floor manager would have both of them drinking heavily. I think they went through, like a case of rum and cherry once a fortnight or something like, It's ridiculous. The floor [00:15:30] managers would say, You know, you'd have a few drinks while over at their house, and you you sort of go home a little bit drunk and sort of forgotten the order of the show, which was probably part of their grand plan. In the scheme of things, you know, just having a few drinks and enjoying what they do as well. Yeah, because it's a party in the kitchen. Oh, it's an absolute party. And they knew what made good television. They knew that when they were bickering that you can see that little glisten in their eyes. When you watch the New Zealand on screen episode, they know that they're making some, you know, amazing television. We don't have television like that. [00:16:00] Now. Everything is so manufactured and homogenised. Our presenters are just so bland and just follow rope. These guys were themselves. And it's just and that spontaneity is what you're trying to capture. Even though you've now got basically a scripted show, I would presume after doing it last year. It's kind of like, um, Apollo, like with with Apollo 13, which is an interactive show. It was a highly scripted show, but by it being highly scripted, it allowed us times to [00:16:30] to engage with anything that was live or spontaneous, and this is the same. This is the exact same thing. You can't control what the food's going to do. You'll be acting on stage looking at cap, and you think something's burning so What are you making? Well, the one I be struggling with the most is the hot cheese soup. And so to not fondue. I remember them for their fondue. We have this cream of cheese soup, which was traditionally served cold, cold, cold cheese. So [00:17:00] it actually just like a just like a sauce. But, um, that's a We've got a hot carrot and raisin salad, Spanish style peas with ham with steamed lettuce. And what are you drinking? What's on the side? That's available. Champagne, sherry, rum, brandy and and lots of white wine. And how much of the humour comes from? That would be that sort of simulated drunkenness cup, do you think? [00:17:30] Yeah, well, look, it, really. It really amps up the stakes of the show because during the show, things start to go. Um, not quite as well as the two would have hoped. And so their coping mechanism is more brandy and which leads to more and more disasters. So the show sort of starts to derail at about the 40 minute mark. Kind of appropriate. I was suddenly thinking about the Hannah Playhouse. Originally set up as a restaurant theatre. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It does have that kind of vibe to it, but we don't want probably any audience members [00:18:00] to eat the food. I'm not quite sure The Gili T that we cook it's quite you can really smell, smell all the cooking. So there's live cooking on stage the whole time. So we've got pots going the whole time and by half time, you can you really get that sense that you're in your grandmother's house in 19 eighties with sort of boiled vegetables, lots of butter and carrots and onions Fire at the door. Have we got a fire at the red? I was just gonna ask you finally, Do you know how when I met you first kept you were working on, um, [00:18:30] your original show, Apollo 13, which went on to have an amazing life, started off. I think at Bats Theatre about seven or eight years ago. So the last time I spoke to you, we were about four days away from opening, opening that show, and we were just We hadn't slept in about six weeks, but and it was super was gonna hold. Yeah, we had phones, gaffer tape to these consoles that were painted by hand. Well, it just people really responded to that style of theatre, a style of theatre that is not just people sitting [00:19:00] passively in a seat and just watching a show. And that show, as a result, went on to have an amazing life both in this country and overseas. So my question is, do you think Hudson and Hall's live would travel? Look, I hope so. The response we got from the Auckland season is was amazing. We sold out every single every single night. We've got a great long season here, which is great next year. We've got a big tour of New Zealand, which we're really excited about, and I think overseas it's got a real shot. It it's full of joy. It's super funny, [00:19:30] and I think it's got quite a British sensibility, So I'd love to travel. Chris is told. Yeah, he's prepared to travel. I've packed my case and I'm ready to go. Well, I know you're gonna have a great night tonight. It's really lovely to see you again. Congratulations on all these shows which seem to have broken through into different sort of style of theatre that you must be very happy about. I'm really excited about it and enjoy yourselves tonight. Thank you very much. Chris Parker and Kip Chapman and the show is called Hudson and Halls Live opening at house in [00:20:00] Wellington this evening.
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