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Dangerous Desires - Same Same But Different

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[00:00:00] This recording is brought to you by the same same but different Writers Festival in pride [00:00:07] Welcome to dangerous desires the gallery into the same same and insecurity George on [00:00:13] an actor, [00:00:13] writer and co owner of Gannett station, cafe, restaurant and tiny theater. Every day the rainbow flag flutters in with smear in the breeze and people gather to exchange these stories. Tonight we're here for an evening of storytelling with a diverse group of authors and community notables who are going to talk about how they found out about the love that did not speak its name. Unfortunately, tonight, Mr. Lyon and Rebecca Swan are unable to attend this evening. Things that change the status quo where the homosexual law reform was signed in New Zealand in 1986. And the marriage equality bill was passed in 2013. Still, it's not always straightforward, finding out about same sex love. talis wrote poetry at the end of the Roman Republic and I translated as in my lesson class at my much loved private girls school. Halfway through my nine years at St. comforts, my mother asked if I'd like to go to a Catholic school. Well, I considered it briefly, but then I declined. By the time I was in high school, there was only three of us in the lesson class. The exclusivity made it so much more exciting. My biggest secret as a teenager was my middle name [00:01:33] is Leslie. [00:01:36] And after being teased with lazy lazy lately, I sensed that it was best to keep my mouth shut. Which is not something that I find very easy to do. [00:01:47] But when I discovered cutlasses poetry to Libya, I could pretend that I had written at least has lived My name is fear licious love, and all the words of the old and so moral, may they be worth less than nothing to us. Sons may sit and sons may rise again. But when our brief light his seat, night is one long, everlasting sleep. Give me 1000 kisses 100 more, another thousand and another hundred and when we've counted up the many thousands, confuse them so it's not to know them all. So that's no enemy may cast an evil eye by knowing that there were so many kisses. Then it was collate than the 1900s writing about married life, sexuality and the problems of a woman's struggle for independence and and a nice men's erotica writing. In 1992, unhappy with workmates calling me I want to be dyke. I was still toying with getting off the bisexual fence You see, when the movie version of Orlando came out? Tilda Swinton, the hero played both sixes over three centuries. This was Virginia Woolf 1928 fantastical biography presented to her lover, Rita sackful West. I did love the naughty 22 I wore my lovely beaded top. But that's enough about me suffice to say that I'm pleased I finally had the courage to come out at 30 years of age after much literary input. The first of the seven that we have talking tonight is Thomas Sainsbury. He grew up in Mathematica. He has a BA at Auckland uni he majored in English Lit and theatre, and on graduating he formed fingerprints and teeth productions. He is prolific. He's a powerhouse of creativity. He's won play markets young playwright of the year four times, and has been a finalist for the Bruce Mason Award and the play market new play award. Several plays have had seasons in London and Australia and it was a co writer on Madeline sammies, fabulous super city series. I've had the pleasure of working with him at Gannett stations time theater and I can say from experience. He's the source of actor that pulls focus your your to [00:04:16] everyone, thanks for the introduction purity. And so I'm Tom [00:04:22] one of and here I am talking about sexuality and discovering it I first knew for a moment when I'd cut in kind of didn't know about sex. And one of my first memories involve sex not me having sex. But I remember getting hold of my sister's Barbie doll which was about this bag. And my brothers Hey man, which was about that big and hiding under my feet and making them go for it. Like this was before school and I'm like enhance out of Mike was I just an acting did I see my parents having CXM was I was I just enacting what I saw, which I hope that's not the case. what I think happened was I grew up on a farm. So like six was around me all the time. They're always like cows having six and chickens hitting six. And I remember distinctly remember my father and his brother having a discussion about rugby while watching to pick Seven, six. So it was quite, I was quite common players. And also I was no and then my family because flyers always chose to mate on me for some reason. So six was always around me. And when people told me when people taught me about six, I kind of already knew everything anyway. And it was also a great source of entertainment for me, and it's called me and my friends, both male and female would have great discussions. And we would we would write this little story that we'd share with each other about the six lives of our teachers. And why who was who was having sex with who and all the female teachers had gargantuan, and tampons and pads and stuff like that was just all very crass and sweaty. But it was never called CX and it was called getting it off or anything like that. We didn't really understand that term. So we've almost mating. So Mr. Price was meetings in Vegas, and it was all very unsexy. And when we discovered what our six was, we were like, this is great. So I'm included in our story, but instead of ORAL it was AURAL. I wonder [00:06:21] what all six. [00:06:24] Um, [00:06:25] I didn't really I wasn't really like a [00:06:26] little closeted homosexual boy growing up cuz I, like I was never I never felt after or anything like that. But like in hindsight, the way that I kind of became obsessed with the main character from strictly ballroom, or the singer who sang the bomba, they made this teli feature was kind of obsessed with these men, but I never kind of dealt with it at the time. So I wasn't like I was this little kid who knew I was different. But um, the first time I kind of came across the homosexual and literature was when we started, when we started a subject at school, we were about eight or nine, it was called cake keeping yourself safe. And it was taught throughout school, and it was like they really hammered home about I don't know, they must have been a meta meta, quite a few molestation cases or something, because they were adamant on getting these little kids to kind of deal with it. And there was this one pop that we had. And the main villain of the piece was this uncle, who, who would like it would be this, he had blond hair, and he had a mustache, they always kind of had mustaches. And there was this, there's always a picture of him silhouetted in the bedroom door, and then you'd come up, come in, and he would touch both boys and girls, you have to be careful you to be on watching out for this kind of behavior. And we learned if you got any inappropriate touching hit to go to a safe person. And usually in these boxes, it was always grandmother's so you can kind of imagine my total confusion, I kind of didn't really sit with me. But one time I went to my grandmother's place and I just swim in a poem was sitting on the couch watching days of our lives. And we're eating a plate of pizza flavored shapes. And we were sitting together and she for like, maybe 30 seconds, she stroked my neck and my upper back, and she said, You're so smooth, and that was there. And I just sit there going, oh my god is this. And I was walking home going, Oh my God, have I been molested what's kind of going on. And then I was like, Who's my safe person, my grandmother's should be my safe person. But she's the one doing the molestation. So I decided to tell my sister was six years older than me and I explained everything was kind of tear at this point in she just said stop in a day. So that was the end of [00:08:43] my first kind of dabbling in pornography, I get all my first kind of erotic book that I read was this one here. [00:08:52] I got it from home. It's called waited I come from. [00:09:00] And it's an illustrated guys inside this is the most erotic picture that I kind of [00:09:05] roll out, but I'll just find it for you. This one [00:09:12] here. So the mother and father By this time, the man wants to get as close to a woman as he can't because he's feeling very loving to hear. And to get really close, the best thing you can do is lie on top of her and put his penis inside you into her vagina. And so I had to kind of look at the action I kind of take it alone but it really after a while it didn't really do anything for me. And then I got what's happening to me, which is the next in the illustration series. And I would spend like a click through and I'll spend ages looking at this picture here. No, it's not that one. It's the next one. And it starts this pictogram of of males developing from the age of eight a 10. And I'd be fascinated with our own look at our read about all the details about money cheering and being said it was quite a rush to khakis when I was quite young but then when I got a bit older it filled me with anxiety and I'll stand in front of the mirror going I don't look anything like that. [00:10:12] And he started like my excessive exercising, exercising around that time. [00:10:19] And me mean after that I kind of dabbled and real pornography and I remember there was a The course was about 11 at the time and at our corner store. There was the magazine rack and it at the very top quite quite a rich was one porn magazine it had a read bag on it with an R rating sign and twice I would come here and just stared up for a minute and I wonder what the shopkeeper thought and then I'd leave and then on the third one when she was scooping someone some ice cream I grabbed it put it on my bag and then just kind of walked out. I never got in trouble for it. And I rice time and I ripped it open [00:10:53] and it was all just [00:10:55] woman just single woman by themselves posing I remember a lot of pills. And and there was one article called this one model and she had an article called My name's Vanya. But don't confuse me with Uncle Vanya. And I remember that the article basically described to turn on some things like that. And then then it said, Don't confuse here with the tragic hero of Jacob's play Uncle Vanya. And I remember even as an 11 year old reading that and going, honey, no one's going to confuse you with Uncle Vanya. After that, a miracle happened. I was going for one of my mini runs at that time to lose weight and look like the kid and look like the boy in the pictogram. And I was running down. And then just on the side of the road was a whole load of scattered pages of poor magazine. And I've actually since found out that this is quite a common occurrence with people fight. I don't know some patron saint of pornography is going around, leaving pages of pornography around. And this one was different from my face, one of their head might mean a woman take a bath, which I am very fascinating. And there's also like little stories that they wrote about, about erotic adventures. And I guess what happened me and was the beginning of the identification with the female rather than the male. And I remember this one story about this read here called Vicky VICKI, and she took was taking it takes eHarmony six, and she could she arrived at a home but she couldn't pay for it because you can bring your wallet so she had to pay for it with sexual services. And I just remember reading this but identify more with Vicki than the taxi driver. later after that, like I started reading a few books with female protagonists they were a little bit saucy. And I found like milsom Boone not very satisfying. I thought the euphemisms of manhood amount of Venice just didn't cut it. And then I read lady Chatterley's lover when I was 15. I got my hands on that. And I just it was a real revelation for me. I remember reading it and just identifying so much with it. It's an it's a brilliant book and it would be one of my favorites but I remember the descriptions of six it was just so kind of erotic but it was also so kind of powerful and visceral. And I just remember reading it and just thinking Yes, I can sign them so the I can totally feel it. And then when I turned 16 we got the Anthony's so if you're in was dial up so if you prepare to wait for one hour, you could watch whatever porn you wanted. very educated that way. Thanks, everyone. [00:13:36] Thank you, Thomas, plentiful. [00:13:38] You reminded me of one of the things in my family bookshelf, which was the little red book [00:13:46] The Little Red Book of all sorts of things. [00:13:51] It was very instructive on how to masturbate. [00:13:55] All right on me next guest is Jim shave. She has a strange comment talents that run from school and university teaching to running a fly fishing Lodge. It seems entirely logical. She's now launching herself in a new direction as a crime writer, with her darkly more than the gentleman's club published in November last year. Thank you. [00:14:22] Thank you. The fishing launch I ran was my partner, McDonald. We had our civil union, the first civil union in the central North Island 10 years ago. But I have to say, Tom, I think I'm probably old enough to be your grandmother. And I didn't come out until I was 45. And I spent the first at least 20 years of my adult life. living as a straight married woman. I told myself not very convincingly that I didn't need a clear gender, gender identity. It wasn't important me and get I felt this terrible tingles when ever I heard that song. I looked it up Smalling apparently was one of the most successful recordings in New Zealand ever. That was Allison Durban singing I have loved me a man like my mama loved. And so I think was came and there I was in my wrong pond living my here for sexual life teaching network and girls grammar with Julie for some of that time and Carol view. And then, probably because various lesbian friends were popping up on the hillside around my pond and sort of waving at me, I knew there was another life out there. I knew that people were leading a life that was not actually denied to me, but it was something that was out there and I thought it was really precious. So I found myself getting involved in homosexual Law Reform activities. I was the middle class housewife. I was going to get a petition drawn up of people like me, not not gay people that I was going to support homosexual law reform. And I did this it was published in the inhaled I got some people around me, we got this huge list of people not nearly as big as chief grey books list. But anyway, we did it. And then the light came on for me one night I went across to a IITs, North Shore campus where Jeff Bray book was speaking. And I had a lot of gay friends with me. And I came along tonight to talk about pitfalls and pitfalls. And I thought one forms as well. My, my, I don't know if it's a pratfall that you spend 20 years of your adult life being straight, you're not really but anyway, Jeffrey book was my first one for a huge fat lump of wonderful, because join that nice, the light really came on for me, I realized that the people that I was there, supposedly talking about writing petitions for I should be with them. So I didn't come out immediately. I just knew that I was going through I spent the next four years or so getting into full starts hopeless relationships, things that I knew were hopeless, the married next door neighbor, the person 25 years younger than me. The seriously clinically depressed suicidal people that I knew were never going to be for me. So but but the I was having these relationships. Finally in about 1990 I left the marriage and I was off I was out. I was I just did that just like that in the end. But in those previous 20 years, at least be as engaged as I say keep kept appearing and intrigued me. I thought they held that key to something precious. I wasn't homophobic at all. I just wasn't one of them. The other fascinated me, but I'd externalised except that my nice private girls school. I used to in my fourth form year kiss Maxine Taylor, every Friday afternoon before we went home for our [00:17:56] weekends. [00:17:58] And it was just kiss was in it's an in public. I mean, now this saw nobody said lazy they were just met seen an engine kissed so that was that was just my part of my life. When I was growing up in the 60s, I smuggled books into wherever I was living. I read them with the torch under the sheets, if I was sharing a room, probably lots of people do that and do that. But do they do it with books about prostitution? This is my biggest pratfall. I actually believe prostitutes to be the most love raised of women. I read everything I could about Mandy rice Davis and Christine Keeler when Jim angry his female unit was published I came to admire her because the sophisticated ones driving the flash cars even more. They've done it. They've broken away from the traditional suburban repressed device realized life that Korea was talking about in the pouring one of the earliest books that I took under the covers with the torch were Twilight women around the world and international picture of other love by somebody called our nation Hessel Roger, I think right one disappeared without trace. He they were prostitutes. They weren't of the of the underworld. They used to identify each other apparently by shaving a patch of the hairy guys, so that they would know who each other was. That was that the next thing that happened was under the covers with two more books the second six by Simone de Beauvoir, which was but to fatten but turgid for 13 year old but the world of Susie one and these two books this is another wonderful my part my obstetrician father this is interesting I don't know why he had expressed to his garden and interest in books like that the Forgotten he gave me these two books the second six of the world if Susie wanted please give these to your father circles they can read straight to me first. And the world of Susie one was fascinating boxes and there's Nam clock hotel and is prostitution again and I just thought it was just fantastic. [00:19:58] Next, I was probably about 20 years ago and I got hold of the hippie hookah by salvia Hollander. [00:20:04] And I don't know whether in my mind in my heart I was one of the men watching the girls or I was one of the one of the girls that there's a very vivid scene in there two girls getting it on and I was transfixed by those dangerous desires were looming. For the lesbian writing, I've got my hands on back then included red lips, whole record halls world of loneliness, which described another kind of oppression. But there was no guilty thrill there for me, there's no hiding the industry. I just thought it was sad and weird. And I knew she was right. People like who viewed themselves as congenital inverts that couldn't possibly be happy, they individually all together, they were always going to be outcasts. So that was a sort of a it was all a way somewhere out there for me. And gradually the book hiding stopped altogether Who would think that the unions and enchantments have separate poetry or Frank's artisans Homer erotic, the whole that jack dog with a sweaty body, the lowlife depravity of Charles Bukowski were bringing my personal bills. Even I could barely hear them. The bells rang louder when I read the pretenders Quinn Davis's unsafely erotic novel about all kinds of imaginable kinds of deviant sexual behavior, hyper sexual hyperactivity everywhere, throws on every page. I didn't hide that and I even recommended it to a few board housewives. And that was followed by Jane rules unseen later, to a lesbian lover he was never quite a lover vividly depicting New York and London and a group of friends as they search and fame for a sustaining love was called this is not for you. And as a film for me that a lesbian life was all too difficult. I could relax I was excused I could stay in what I thought all this my side, ignoring, sexually active but unfulfilled, yearning on my calm like I have no regrets. But I would like to say I can't help being a bit curious about what would have happened how different things might have been me if I'd found one of those Clinton American newsletters written by lesbians calling themselves the daughters of bonuses. For example, the letter edited by Phyllis Lyon also known as and focus on vice versa created and edited by Edith EAD, also known as Lisa being nice anagram there was what if I'd found the price of soul Patricia Highsmith also known as clear Morgan, all those aliases, so many guises? I can't help being curious about what would have happened if I had my wake up call much sooner than 1986 got rid of my own guys perhaps the biggest pratfall of all for me in my 20s instead of my 40s. [00:22:46] Thank you very much. Tim perhaps is another book. [00:22:52] Excuse dangerous desires was the title of his groundbreaking 1991 book that won the New Zealand Book Award among other prizes. He's been a filmmaker, think desperate remedies, Jane Austen on acid. He's looked back at the correct place of our colonial past. And now he's taken some time out and bought us the same same but different festival. I believe it's peaceful wheels. [00:23:25] Thanks very much. [00:23:29] I subtitled this where I titled this my juicy talk. [00:23:37] Because I'm a writer, I will read from what I've read. [00:23:42] At different times in your life, you're a different person. And 1975 I was in Paris for the first time in my life. And I was with a friend from Auckland. Or rather, I wasn't with a friend from Oakland. We had got on the train together from Charing Cross. But on a stoned Jaffe moment, I decided that I need to get off the train and go and get something to eat. It took longer than I thought and rescues and I had to run to catch the train. Perhaps I didn't explain to the guard where I was going. Or perhaps the guy was just I'm a father. I found myself in the Hitchcockian nightmare of a train going in the wrong direction. term that was the name of my friend was on the train to focused whereas I was fatally on the train to Dover. We had no way of getting in touch with each other. We hadn't planned what hotel we were staying in Paris, the following day across the channel and settled into the said business of being in Paris city of love. That was not with my friend. They remarkably like something out of a dream and something you would expect in a city or size of Auckland, but not on Paris. I saw turn walking towards me. Just as lonely and miserable as I was. He spotted me just as ice buffet. We shrieked like to cooker bars, as was our want. 1000 tasteful Parisien eyebrows were raised simultaneously, as 1000 pair of eyes consigned us to the oblivion martyrs liaison way with an edit black mark of like poof. But we couldn't have cared less. We were too crazy and Tivoli and posters and a place we both realized from calling Paris France, as it was always called an American sitcoms. This was a reflection of the fact so much of our culture at the time and New Zealand was really important three films or box or TV. Maybe that was the reason Tim and I talked to one another and totally fine EX hence. One of these accents was American deep south, as spoken by Vivien Leigh and Streetcar Named Desire, which has been mentioned several times over the today. The other was Scottish, as spoken by Maggie Smith and the prime of Miss Jean Brodie. So we just walked around talking to each other either in deep Southern accents or scholarships and wildly hopeless XY, the accents, I've often wondered this, maybe because the world around us appeared. So finding we thought we were better actors in a crazy sitcom we hadn't invented and didn't fetch with them. Well, maybe our own native voice was to Tinder to me used to naked to be trusted. Seven wasn't out, so I knew he was good. I also knew he befriended me because I was out. He probably thought I knew what I was doing. I didn't, I was making it up as I went along. We shared something really, really important. I knew even then I was going to be a writer. And he was a writer who had done columns and hot Lex, which proceeded wrap it up magazine. They need been adopted by Brian fieri when he came to New Zealand, which Tim parlayed into working for Brian ina and London. Later, he would become famous as Tony blanks of fashion TV editor at large of And I'm sure he takes this super unstylish version of his first trip to Paris. But at this stage, he was just my friend, melancholic. His father had died probably five years earlier. And he was in love with a bisexual boy who told me into crawling turn was also very funny and we were ideas, girlfriends and away enjoying our first time together and Paris, France, really without much money between us. But what is this to have sex? With an hour or so of us meeting up almost an spirit of celebration I expertly shoplifter and American Pope Paul novel one of the porn shops we intend to use shortlisted I thought I was being je ne ne journal a phase of my life I have long left behind I swear Carol [00:28:16] the moment we got the book we cracked it's fine open and took turns reading out loud and loud and XM two voices paragraph Ashley startling obscenity. I'm actually the accent but this is just an example. I was hypnotized. The bastard was either a witch or a goddamn vampire who lived on fructose instead of blood. This time the tunnel was reversed the wrong end of the telescope was the right one he started look even bigger in real life. And as our soul was starting to feel like it could swallow the hole and one reverse movement like a flesh lead vacuum cleaner. The book was full of startling dimensions as well as amazing language that strange to evoke sexual action. CCC CCUUMMMNMNMIINNGJGGGG would run over several lines of print rising into capitals as it got near the point of no return. right ahead call the stage at 1973 I was just on the threshold of the macho movement that would take over the gay male world immediately pre AIDS. So the book is drenched, as it says 200% man to man action. On Shane I'm full of sick pieces like a full on orgy and a sauna rate fantasy with a group of superheroes and black men, but it also encompass little nuggets of real life wisdom we recognize from life and Auckland quote, when you achieve official status as a career in our town, you automatically lose your claim to membership of the human race was written by someone called allegedly Jade Cox another author was Peter picker. Leslie a g8 cops this God Cox was clearly highly literate. The narrative was actually structured and accomplished in a complex and sophisticated way, with two journals commentating on each other, like an 18th century of history for a novel. Much later I found out Christopher Isherwood often used his downtime to write porn, I wonder. Right a hot cup was printed on the cheapest closest paper by San Diego publisher. It comes from a time and there was virtually no image based pornography, very little phone no video at all, maybe just standard eight from and the book and the magazine trade covertly carried a cargo of only slightly underground porn. You have to be over 21 and sign a document to get it posted within the US. [00:30:50] YR tonight and reading the book out loud. [00:30:54] It was a joke against the supercilious French really against those polished Parisians who went out of the way not to understand the Barbarian China of English. So of course they couldn't possibly acknowledge that there is we're now receiving a tidal wave of an gourds genitalia, and associated a flu via like the dodo Dodo vegans, aka Stephen shortlists sexual politics and action. The friendship cause and the dilemma of having to pretend they simply didn't understand, just as Terminator had to pretend we were incredibly interested in the sexual logistics and athletics being described. The fetch was neither term nor I were actually sexually experienced at all. And this book which we took to life and reading aloud and ridiculing, was actually quite instructive, on a sort of mechanical level, which we knew very little about. As we walked along the streets of the city of love, reading aloud and mock deep Southern or mock Scottish accent Brian with last after, we were silently instructing ourselves on all sorts of stuff we needed to know. I'm sure it's not the first or the last time pornography has been used to learn about sexual techniques. I've always been very grateful for this book, which on one level is just a piece of brazen porn, this whole point is to arouse you and get you off. But which was actually quite complex and the way I was written talked of moods and feelings, tried to describe sexual feelings which God knows as a writer, I know a very difficult to translate into words. And in a way that was absolutely typical for two writers. Neither of us Mitch the flesh and blood moon about dreams and Paris, France, City of love. We were too busy with our noses buried in a book. Thank you [00:33:05] for carrying on our themes of shoplifting and pornography. [00:33:12] Her real name is fidelity, aliases diesel dyke poet. [00:33:17] She is a performance poet [00:33:19] when the title of muscle Ricky poet for 2010 and [00:33:23] 2012. [00:33:24] And also the winner of poetry out of 2015. [00:33:30] diesel powered has performed at heroes out west, which sadly does not exist anymore. And lights on lights at Gannett station, which does exist still. She has a massive collection of over 700 poems. She is a psychologist by profession but prefers to be a spoken word artist and writer. [00:34:00] I have to say that I've never been at a venue where I've had so many ex girlfriends. [00:34:07] This poem is entitled woman [00:34:10] or girlfriend. [00:34:12] When Finally I shake loose the status. I'll be brief in your morning. You'll feel me and the band pull over the moon. As you breathe in the sunrise vapors from sacred waters shall rise and the altar that is your mind. I'll be your conscience staring back at you from the mirror. Dressed in Tuxedo Black with tails are like the sun and the moon. The dimensions between a woman and a girlfriend obvious a girlfriend will cause your heart to flood a woman okay straight through us she's oozing pheromone skulls and you'll have to skip beats every time you even breathe in her direction. A girlfriend give you a butterfly and French kisses a woman will take your tongue slip and slide it melts in your lips like candy floss he merely jitsu way into hyperactive diesel space Virgo offering will come into your funny yeah that's right your house a mic well should do things or a woman a woman will come into your life clean up your bad habits along with your bed banking behavior to [00:35:31] girlfriend [00:35:32] will help you find pieces to a puzzle you know putting some kind of like dangerous connection together about you and her but a woman will help you find peace in your soul putting your relationship back together with you and your goddesses. The girlfriend will take off all of her clothes and tell you that's what she'll tell you that have six whether or make lecture or something like that but a woman a woman will take off all who fears like her pride along with his seat between the sheets and lingering on your pillow. She'll permit you to be with her she's reconsidering or deconstructing new approaches to ending homophobia racism, sexism, all bigotry. ZC because hell of make making is an act of revolution. I've been tripping over girls hyperbole, I gotta be tripping over my own tight shoe laces. digging the concrete reality there is girlfriend space. blindfolding myself I'm Kane roads are so later brighter. But I'm sorry, I'm just going to say this. girlfriends offer one of the 30 something year old or younger. I mean, you know, you take them home and you introduce them to the Father you say father, meet the new Mrs. But woman, yeah, especially my woman was the reason I could sleep night she was the reason why happy could make fun the sound like symphonies. She was the professional vaguely realize the others were just unpaid work without retirement satisfaction guarantee, and I'm not finished it. Okay. [00:37:05] girlfriends. [00:37:09] Amazing. But it's kind of like, a crutch about to become your cage. But a woman, a woman's got the backbone and the pull of the moon. You know, I think most of us tend to settle for packages a lot less than what we think we have. But I've been dressing myself in front of the mirror long enough to know what looks good on me. And what doesn't kill. [00:37:47] You can tell them my kind of narrative is Butch. And I make no apologies for that. [00:37:56] Last night, I talked about [00:37:58] the, [00:38:01] I guess, my first in my early experiences with, with women with with the concept of [00:38:13] loving mind. [00:38:16] And I was only four. And it was an electrifying experience. And the TV screen got turned off. But [00:38:25] that that energy [00:38:29] you know, the energy that you have between someone is, is incredible. And [00:38:36] I think that in the mainstream [00:38:42] in the mainstream narrative. [00:38:46] It's so controlled. And I think that's something that we don't have, we don't have a narrative about what we should be, or how we should behave. I mean, if we look at the constructs that we have now it's it's incredible. And it's amazing. And so I come on here to support same same but different because of their Ok, so I give a big money out to the trans community. Big money out to my community is he's been in a big media to the game community as well and to the LGBT QIAP. community. [00:39:32] So chocolatier. [00:39:42] Someone asked me what does the AP mean at the end of the LGBT? [00:39:49] LG? Okay. Yes. [00:39:52] trend. [00:39:56] to Korea, I indices I I see Trump and pay pay. Great. [00:40:07] Ally. [00:40:09] Thank you. Thank you. [00:40:13] Next, Nick Jones is one of the new voices being introduced to this year. He's been studying creative writing at IUT. And last year scooped up the prize for best graduate student. He was the finest at the New Zealand writers college short story competition. Tonight he's going to be reading a short excerpt from his untitled coming of age novel sit in a small town with hallucinatory overtime. [00:40:48] So I'm going to read a shortened down chapter from an overload was just introduced. I am reading from a female perspective. So forgive me if I get it wrong. If I get it wrong, tell me like afterwards, and then I can fix it. So I basically it just revolves around a character named Susan as a child discovering that the boy that she has a crush on isn't like every other boy. Once Adam was in the center of things, once he was in my dreams, kids have silly crushes silly crushes on silly kids, but he was all the feminine and close to my attractions. The way little boys tend to be. My memory paints a picture of the child back then was to be here. Fine. doc and straight, long lashes pale skin. Two freckles darting his cheeks and nose is stubble on his chin nowadays, but that little boy is still there. The Summer of 95 it's vague in the picture of paint. See it's still beautiful, still innocent. Mom and Dad were from out of town. With college boxes carrying our lives inside we moved into the neighborhood and to a small white wouldn't place away from the city. The moving van was in the driveway. mom and me. We were unpacking boxes and the vacant living room. Dad was helping the driver carry furniture. dropping it all in the front yard. unpacking boxes wasn't my ideal way of spending the morning trying to escape out the front door away to explore mom shouted at me, Susan Lucy fence and you get your little bump back in here. My pace quickened, head down looking at my feet. She continued You nearly six years old now girl time you carried your weight. Who voice echoed in the empty house behind me as the door closed? The first day at a new school is always hard, especially when you arrive late and the term me up front of the class like a coming of age film. Teachers hand on my back. Now everyone this is Susan. She's new, blonde little girls and picked out tethered to each other behind whispering hands. I sat in the back and interval this kid came up the first one. Hi said I'm Adam. With him a curious looking boy dark skinned and astonishing blue eyes. He smiled nervously at me and nudged his friend on this is Tyler. Tyler live just around the corner from the school and estate on home. He was polite and a little shy. The two sort of adopted me. It was a relief to have friends again. weeks went by and most mornings and knock on Adams front door would announce my presence. This little girl blushing we need open it up and invite me inside. Adam was my prince charming. The problem was he wasn't into it. It wasn't just in the way that he ignored me, or how he blushed whenever certain boys spoke to him. There was something else and me a voice which started to whisper that Adam was different. All the other boys age with plucking up the courage to ask goes out for the interview disco. But Adam kept himself. For weeks whenever Adam began a sentence with Susan. My ears would perk up hoping desperately to hear the full sentence hoping to hear those words. Susan, will you go with me? I just don't get why he won't ask me. I said Tyler blush to flip through the pages of his book. Maybe he's just not interested in the disco. But why not? The outward librarian looked up at this and shushed us. I don't know he said, My legs curled up into my knees were planted beneath my chin. My face buried into my jeans groaning annoyed adult that is Tyler's book slowly closed. I was gonna go with Julie he said co replied. No, I mean, I was going to go with Julie But hey, if it means that much to you, I'll say no to her. Tyler. Now listen to me if it means that much to you. I'll I'll say no to her and I don't know I could go with you. Ty know go with Julie. I said I don't want your night to be lame because Adam one asked me. I'm going to ask him instead. I decided why can't the girl asked the guy I'm gonna do of course. Okay. Tyler put his arm around my shoulder and squeeze me a little. There's no rule. The next morning when Adam walked into I glared at him. Adam McCormick is dizzy sitting next to me. You will take me to the disco whether you want to or not. He looked like i'd slept and what? Another glare? Yeah, sure. Okay, and that was that. [00:45:31] School discuss suck ass, especially when they're full of 10 and 11 year olds. Everyone's just standing around awkwardly, too afraid to dance with the dates. These geeky kids getting on sugar rushes from the frame many soda bottles on supply. cool kids grinding one another mimicking what they've seen on TV. Adam had arrived on my doorstep in a dress shirt and pants. He looked handsome. I smiled. Wow. He laughed when he still made you wearing a dress. My smile turned into a frown and we linked arms and walk down to the school. Halfway through the night Adam disappeared from the brightly decorated hole. He must have slipped off for my hands busy themselves with paper plates and cakes at the snack table. And it only been a few minutes but he was gone. seated on one of the chairs off to the side. Tyler look glumly up at his date dancing with all your friends. He saw me watching and shrugged. Hey, there was a chair next to him waiting for me. You look beautiful, Susan. He said. Thanks Ty you look cool to have you seen Adam anywhere. I've lost him. had him all right. I'm not maybe he's outside. The side door exit lead out to the basketball court. Some kids were laughing out on the concrete. It sounded wrong. And then there was a shout from behind some trees. Get off me faggot. behind those trees. Jason, this guy who played football, lived away from the park bench he'd been sitting on a second voice stood up. He was all nervous and confused. It was Adam. Jason, he whispered. His tone was muffled. He said something else that I couldn't that couldn't be heard, and the older boy suddenly barged forward, his fist twisting Adams dress shut up around the collar. He slammed Adam against one of the trees. He responded in a violent whisper being pulled his other fist back and punched at him hard in the face. Adam fell to the ground blood spilling from his nose. Adam rush forward. As he crawled to his feet he saw me standing there. Among the other kids who had heard all the commotion. His face was cold and empty. The blood drip down and over his upper lip. Stay the fuck away from me. Jason said before storming off. I'd been over and helped Adam up and pulled him back to the bench so he could sit down. Tyler stepped out of the hole to check on the noise. He saw me with Adam. Then the rest of the crowd staring. He blanked for a moment in shouted Hey everyone giving away free movie tickets inside. He nodded at me and then stepped aside as the kids rushed back in the doors. He followed him behind him. What happened? I asked. Adam wiped his bloody nose on his sleeve and tried to stand up. Let me go he said he got to his feet eventually and began walking out of the school gates and onto the footpath. No wait, why did that kid hit you? He stopped looked at me. They were tears in his eyes. I'm gay. Okay. His lower lip trembled. I like other boys. devastation erupted in my body. Tears formed in my eyes, but were blinked out before you could notice all of my wasted affection set upon my chest. Jason, his city lights me. He said he wanted to kiss me but someone saw us. I guess he thought he could hide it if he smashed me. Adam dropped to the curb and buried is hidden his hands now everybody will know. He was right. Everybody didn't know the next Monday at school. Jason, he invented this whole story. He told everyone Adam had blew them away to talk about sports. He said once they were alone, Adam and tried to force Jason to cast them out there on the dock. We passed by groups of kids at the school cafeteria me Adam and Tyler. They'd whisper amongst themselves was like queer and faggot bounce to the classrooms. In between classes when we would grabbing out books kids would play jokes and stuff Adams locker with extra thick anal condoms. Gotta keep safe bag someone would shot as the plastic strips fell from his locker to the floor. Thanks, Adam would reply teasing back I'll need them for when I fuck your dad. My crush on Adam went dormant only to be working up twice during those teenage years. It takes me such here and there suggested that my heart may have had a chance. He even kissed me one night when we were drunk under the moon. But sober those events were quickly ignored. Once Adam was in the center of things once he was in my dreams thanks. [00:50:27] Certainly the discos are a member we quite that juicy. [00:50:34] Ground Robins robertson is the finance spokesperson for the Labour Party. [00:50:40] And the rainbow MPYKH is more for Wellington central since 2008. He writes his own speeches people. He contributes to blogs, and he grew up Indonesian. And he has flown to Auckland to have a 30 day weekend. [00:51:05] Thank you for the introduction. I can I start by just congratulating PETA and everybody involved in the festival. I think this is tremendous, tremendous initiative and one that you know I really hope grows and grows and grows over time. So well done. [00:51:27] When I was thinking about what to what to talk about today, I ran through my list of all coming out fiction literature a little bit like Stevens in some way the farmers catalog was a very big part of my career that spans the shop rather than anything else. And that frigate large presence, I could dwell on it refer to the famous five books. And I felt hugely vindicated in slightly later years, when the comic strip troupe in the UK produce the five Go man things, and Julian was this very bath, older brother in the family. And that kind of resonated with where I got not so much in the five year period where there was uncle Clinton who was always described as the screaming homosexual uncle Brendan, which kind of made sense to me. So I could have talked about that tonight. And I could have talked about other books and it would have almost become a bit fanboy ish because it would have involved Peter and Stephen and witty, Myra and all sorts of people who really meant a lot to me as I grew up. The Tales of the City books which I stole off my mother's bookshelf to read were hugely important. And I thought I was Michael and I went through all of that. But I've actually decided to do quite possibly the most preposterous thing that a politician could do is the only non writer on a panel. I've written a short story for tonight. [00:52:57] And you all get to be the people to hear it. So it is they say in the stories it's based on true events and does resonate about my growing up and donating and it's called Operation city bookshop. Towards history teacher Mr. Snow could see that every successful military campaign had three elements, planning, preparation, and perspiration. Todd suddenly had the leisure and bucket loads as he ran down Beach Road to get the number seven Normandy best to town. He had done his planning and preparation, but nothing could be taken for granted. Toward hustle past the suburban shops open for Friday late night. Did they know Mr. Lang of lanes butcher he stared out the window. His chubby eyes meeting towards he quickly turned to his assistant and then back to toward and possibly thought thought smiled. Next door at the video shop. Todd can see Mr. Lee, the owner of Ross Lee VF is counter. He moved even quicker. Things that got awkward with Mr. Lee since the day Todd had rented boys in the band. he'd taken it up to the counter between Ghostbusters and Back to the Future. But they were new releases and had to be wrapping up at the other two or something like that. Mr. Lee and see. He has taught a lot of questions about boys in the band and why it had caught Todd Todd talked about music and bands, but not about boys. Mr. Lee said boys in the band wasn't taken out very often and the talk can keep it an extra week. And he smiled in a way that Todd later learned to describe as knowingly. Mr. Lee was on the PTA with Todd dead. So when Todd took the video back the next day, he told Mr. Lee son who was on the counter that he didn't like it very much. Why should I care? Ross levy Jr. Granted safely across the world road and hit the stop towards saw the best lights appear in the distance. He looked into the window of Helens here design. Helen way down to talk. He halfway back. He wondered why Helen had become a hairdresser. She always kept her here as a military crop cat. And she only ever wore jeans and a plaid shirt which was really different from most of the other people in the neighborhood. Helen didn't know his plans no one could know towards planes. Operation city bookshop was taught. The plan was simple. Take the best to town. Go to city bookshop make us purchase and give him all before the last invest in any needs parental involvement. The first stage of the plan was simple city bookshop was just a five minute walk across queens Gavin's from the exchange, taught and practice all of this the week before. Mr. Snow we've called this covert reconnaissance. He'd gone to the shop and confidently walked up to the counter and seed and a voice lad enough to ensure most of the shop would here. Do you have a cricket section? This was an instantly believable alibi. Todd loved cricket. He had a poster of New Zealand's best bowler on his bedroom wall. The player had a mustache and the top two buttons of the chute were and down revealing a meta DAC here. Todd 40 look like Tom Selleck, another member of the team had recently started advertising for jockey underwear. Todd had a copy of that too in a drawer beside his beard. In any case, on the reconnaissance mission, the old man behind the counter who looked like a poet taught and studied at school, motion Turn to the back of the shop, taught already knew where the books were, but waited and made sure he sought confirmation he was hitting in the right direction. Description was another word Mr. snowed us talking about war. The sports books were in the corner next to a section called lifestyles. Tom didn't know what that meant. But he'd seen what he needed to three magazines stuffed awkwardly into the end of the shelf. The title wasn't fully visible but the word man and capital letters walls and more to the point the picture of the naked bodies have to mean locked and embrace presented itself boldly. planning and preparation Todd thought as he got off the bus on Friday night with his friends. It was that now he chosen his outfit carefully. The long trench coat he bought from the shop and the wooden tripping he made him phallus recognizable before [00:57:29] bed really is true. [00:57:32] The old man was at the cancer Todd went by without a word his plan was simple. Pick up a cricket eliminate two x's cover, pick up the magazines and straight to the counter. The coast was clear. Try to move confidently planning chick preparation chick perspiration triple chick. He pulls the trigger Dominic cricketing Tom Selleck was on the cover. A pleasant surprise. Two steps forward and he reached out to get the magazines all the military precision in the world goes nowhere without intelligence Mr. Snowden See? How could 150 page magazine cost $20 toward notice that the price in US dollars was $3 50. Todd always wanted to live in America and basil expect the unexpected Mr. Snow. Todd folded the magazine under the almanac and kept walking. For the first time in the history of city bookshop. There was a queue at the counter toward studied the cover of the omernick. cricketing Tom Selleck was in his delivery stride every muscle straining, captured a second from release, taught Mr. Snow cricket tricks taught thrusting the almanac towards Mr. Snow. Again for gentlemen Mr. Snow See, not looking at the minute but now fully staring at the magazine with its title exposed in book capitals. Man on man. President perspiration hit now between planning and preparation. What kind of history teacher hangs around in bookshops on a Friday night. He reached the front of the queue and held the book and magazine in one hand and to 20 dolla nights and the other defiantly not turning around. The bookshop owner peruse the books as if he had never seen them before. Lifting white up and then the next the man's will have shouted out we've got a gay one here. And then just as he had planned, the owner took his money returned a handful of coins and the books in a brown paper bag. Todd walked out into the cold winter year. The Unexpected important costs of men on man means a long walk home. He considered tipping the public phone in the gardens to get a ride from his mother. But there would have been a major diversion from the plan and it hit enough of those for this mission mission. Man on man private place and Todd's bedside drawer. He made sure to study the cricket Almanac as well over the weekend in case Mr. Snow wisdom about it on Monday. But he didn't and amazingly he didn't say anything to talk either. The unit on World War Two finished and Mr. Snow started to get very excited about the kings and queens of tutors do it England after a few days taught declared operation city bookshop a success and moved on to his next mission. A far least risky of fear. He had found a classified ad in the newspaper where you could order man on man by post. He was expecting the first issue in the mail anytime he planned it out. He knew the post these times and he pretty prepared to be there and he had cover if anyone asked what this was all about he said I have no idea how I pass over Mr. Snow could end up being delivered to me it's the [01:01:03] beginning of a new career. [01:01:08] A big thanks to the very tiny and and illuminating speakers tonight. I was so many thanks to the same same festival sponsors IUT pride Gabba gay and zip Simpson Grayson, the Wallace Foundation and creative New Zealand I remember attending the very first Auckland readers and writers festival playing by piece of words and Stephanie Johnson and I'm I'm chuffed to have been asked to be involved in this inaugural literary event. So thank you very much Peter. Books are for sale in the foyer. And thank you to Carol for from the woman's bookshop for always being there for us. So thank you. [01:01:56] Can I just thank you all for coming along to this for beginning of the festival. It's been tremendous ride the whole way through. I would like to give a special thanks to Julie Watson who has really been the person who's held it all together all the way through [01:02:24] the audience to thank you so much

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