[00:00:00] This program is brought to you by pride in zero.com. Do you
[00:00:05] think that the queer community is very accepting of people that are in gender and sexual minorities within it?
[00:00:13] Sometimes? I would not say although
[00:00:17] there's a, I think in terms of gender stuff, there's a lot of kind of trends, seasonality kind of stuff like that all that, like, people, like some weird hierarchy where some trans people or some people have decided that you have to be trans enough to be considered trends at all. What do you mean by trends and not like
[00:00:39] you have to
[00:00:40] have transitioned and had surgery and they own hormones, or at least be willing to do that, until you can be considered trends enough? Like there's a lot of sectioning kind of stuff. It's not
[00:00:54] that from within the trans community itself.
[00:00:56] Yeah, yeah. And, you know, the rest of the community is not all that accepting. I guess it def is where you go, like, I've been a lot more accepted, and say, Wellington, then here and Nelson or anything smaller. And, you know, it's not, it's not perfect anywhere that the queer community and other places definitely say more capable of understanding that identity is very large.
[00:01:28] Do you think that that is something which is specific to being in a big city? Do you think it's generally more accepted in larger cities? Or? I think so.
[00:01:35] Um, I couldn't say why. I think it's, I think it's just more of a,
[00:01:43] you know, there's a lot more diversity in a big city.
[00:01:47] Whereas in small cities, kind of, you know, everybody knows everybody. if anything changes, then everybody knows, and that kind of stuff. And often it scares them in smaller studies, but in big cities, there's kind of, yeah, you know, more diversity got out, you've got to learn to be more open to things. Not that everybody is but you know,
[00:02:06] so you talked about people being scared before is that people within the queer community, do you think or people will more in mainstream communities,
[00:02:14] um, probably, I'd say more than mainstream, but definitely in the quick movie as well, especially. Because quite faithful, kind of, you know, say I, I told somebody in the community that I was gender queer, and they kind of tried to accept it, but not quite. And I think that's more of a lot of, I don't know, like, a stigma or something around it. Because it's just not heard about much. And, you know, I think queer people kind of hide behind our work, we know everything.
[00:02:50] And use it as kind of an excuse to
[00:02:54] not learn about things and to not stop being afraid of these things. And instead of actually opening up to it, they just kind of hide from it. But they have some excuse for
[00:03:06] um, would you say that you face more discrimination or oppression? Generally, than someone who would be part of the more mainstream queer community? Yeah, minority?
[00:03:20] Yeah, I guess.
[00:03:22] I mean, I guess from outside community. Yeah, I guess a lot of, you know, even in quickness of the big issue is pronouns.
[00:03:33] Water pronouns, for those who don't know,
[00:03:36] basically, what you prefer to be referred to as so say, like, hey, Shay, they them to hear that kind of stuff. And I use unit neutral pronouns. And, you know, so I prefer to be cold day in them. Yeah. So, you know, I think a lot of stuff around pronouns is difficult for people, because I think they're so used to having a, like, kind of binary pronouns being used all the time. I can understand being used to that. But I can, I can't understand, refusing to try and use other pronouns for the people like, I get misty into it all the time, in terms of pronouns, like people just using the wrong ones, when I specifically say don't know,
[00:04:27] from an awakening
[00:04:28] community, as well as the more mainstream community, it's not, you know, desirable. And I, I have seen some stuff about it. But I feel that because people don't necessarily understand a lot about gender identity. Even in the queer community, they're not, you know, they're not all that prone to accepting it. And evil, I guess, they find it difficult to respect somebody today, because they don't. I don't agree with that. But they just don't, don't get up. I get how important
[00:05:04] Would you say that it's more an issue of understanding then of purposely being hurtful?
[00:05:11] Yeah, yeah, definitely, um, I think a lot of the people that I've come across anyway, have just had more difficulty understanding a lot about identity, you know, why? A lot of them have, you know, they just kind of become part of the equation today, and they don't, you know, they're not as kind of well educated about all the stuff as others are that have been in there for a while or so I think that they are just new to it. And they don't really know. And I think there are some of them that, you know, as time goes on, they realize, Oh, you know, this is really important. I need to, I need to start respecting this and trying to do it and correcting myself if I'm not, but then there's other people who just I think it's not intentionally hurting people, it's a stuffing, it doesn't really matter. Because I don't get how, you know how hurtful it is.
[00:06:07] So in an ideal world, what do you think it would be like to come out as someone who was in gender minority?
[00:06:18] In an ideal world, I guess it would just, you know, you wouldn't have to, or you could just, you know, say to somebody, you know, Hi, I'm non binary, or something like that. And I use these pronouns, and I'll just do it. And, you know, at least attempt to do it, and then correct themselves and everything like that, and actually, kind of respect how you identify and respect that it is a real thing, not just something that you've made up to be quirky and different.
[00:06:47] I mean, we're a long way from that, I guess. But
[00:06:52] I think, with the queer community, not really, trying as hard as I could to understand and space, non binary people were even further away. Like, they really need to, you know, nobody's really going to take us seriously about if we don't take ourselves seriously.
[00:07:12] And how do you think we can achieve that? So what steps can we take as people who are part of the queer community to try and make it a more accepting place for people in minorities? Um,
[00:07:27] I guess just not kind of
[00:07:30] just really listening to them, instead of just kind of hear it, like, really, really hear what they say, you know, if somebody calls you out and pronouns or something, then listen to them and ask, you know, ask what they prefer you to call them, if somebody changes their name to something they, you know, feels a lot more comfortable for them, don't use their old name, or tell people that all name or something like that, and just respect them.
[00:08:01] I think we just need to kind of stop, stop
[00:08:09] kind of invalidating how people feel by saying, Well, you know, with putting the blame for us, screwing things like, you know, screwing up pronouns, or names or something on to the person whose name or pronoun with us growing up.
[00:08:25] You talked before about names, do you think names are very important to people? Who, in the trans community?
[00:08:32] Yeah, definitely, um, I know that for me, I'm changing my name from what my parents called me, felt really Frank and more independent, especially because, you know, I haven't told them the grand total, that I've changed my name for people in the queer community and my friends in the kind of stuff. And so that was really kind of freeing and made me feel like I've actually I got my own identity like I am, you know, my own person. And it's, you know, that I that I have now is a lot more natural than what I did have. And I think that's really important to me, I'm having a kind of a note tonight, because I can, I don't know what I'm gonna be every day and that kind of stuff. And I know that because, you know, names, what you always associated with? So like, you know, when your main identifier, you don't want that? Not you want to clashing with how you feel and who you are.
[00:09:37] You talked before about your relationship with your parents and telling them that you are part of a gender minority? Is that something which is difficult? Or a lot of people have to go through? Do you think,
[00:09:49] situation, I think that it is, you know, it's really difficult.
[00:09:54] Being not on the cause of it is not being out.
[00:10:00] cuz I've got a
[00:10:02] kind of signal to my friends, and I come over, like, no, don't call me this year, and use these pronouns and all this kind of stuff. And try and, like, sectioned off different parts of my life for my parents, and I did uni applications. And I use Kennedy on those and I got sent home, and I had to try and get the mail before my parents did and that kind of stuff. And so that's it's really hard not being out. But at the same time, I think it's easier than it would be if I was because I'm, you know, now I've just got to kind of hide things. But should they find out at this point? You know, they're not very accepting of that kind of stuff? Should they find out at this point? I don't think it'll be it'll go down very well. I don't really like to think about what what happened because I feel like maybe a lot of proportion, but I'm just really scared of it. I don't know that a lot of people in the same situation. Often, you know, they're really scared to not necessarily think that's more than not knowing what would happen. Because, as I said, before, people are really scared by this kind of thing. It's not something you hear about every day. So especially with parents, you know, you feeling like your identity doesn't exist. And they have not thinking that it does, you know, coming out to the Muslim in their neighborhood, all this is gonna be terrifying for them. And they may not react well. But I've had good stories of non binary people coming out. But I think for me, I'm just kind of scared of what could happen.
[00:11:41] Do you think it's very fair that people have to live in this fear? i?
[00:11:45] Not at all, I don't think that's, you know, it's not fair at all. I mean, I've become a really good liar.
[00:11:52] But, um,
[00:11:54] and it's, you know, I guess you kind of gain certain things like, no, how to hide things, who do you need to and that kind of stuff, but it's not desirable. I mean, I just want, I don't want to have to live in this kind of secrecy. Like, I feel like I'm living some weird double life. But I'm not. Like, it's kind of him. And I just, I think, I think everybody just needs to, like, if I could, I would just make it so that everyone doesn't know about this stuff. Like, I wouldn't have to go through with the education and the stages and stuff that just know that it was just okay. But yeah.
[00:12:35] How
[00:12:36] are your friends and peers and accepting who you are, because you're talking about your family.
[00:12:45] Most of my friends a really good about it. Mainly the ones in the queer community and some others.
[00:12:52] I
[00:12:55] win when I got together with my girlfriend. A while ago, I was still going by my old name to her. And I was really worried because everybody else was calling me the other night. And so I, you know, she kind of approached me one day, and I was really scared of telling her because I was afraid of what she'd say. I was afraid that she wouldn't accept all that kind of stuff. I had all these fears. And then she kind of approached me one day and said, Would you prefer that I call us us, because everybody else does. And I'm not too sure if that's, you know, our preferred thing? And I just said yes. And then she did. And so that was really nice. Most of my other friends have been really kind of accepting and go along with it when I changed my name, and respect whatever pronouns I use that day. And then there are others who don't know, and I've, or others that say, you know, I know you was there. So I don't want to call you What name you prefer, because it doesn't feel comfortable for me. I guess it's a mixed reaction, I try to hang out the ones that, you know, I got a better
[00:14:02] what about other aspects of your life? So school or work? How do people understand or treat you because of
[00:14:09] your
[00:14:12] work? Nobody really knows about, you know, they will call me by my own name. So don't really know about the gender side of things. But that choice you've made? Yeah. I said, I just couldn't deal with the little drama around that, because they're all people I work with a very kind of hit or normative and
[00:14:33] all that kind of stuff. And
[00:14:36] I, yeah, so they, you know, they use my own name and female pronouns and that kind of stuff. Which is fine. I've learned to kind of accept it at work. But then I get really nervous when people kind of people that I know like, from the queer community come in, and they called me this day, and I'm like, Oh, no, okay, I do them first, and all that kind of stuff.
[00:14:59] I don't really know how
[00:15:03] I could take it if
[00:15:05] people found out later, just because when they found out that I was on strike, they wouldn't exactly know there was some of them that will kind of they'll find with the, the fine with that. And the way that they wanted to pry me around to all the friends that have got a girlfriend, those kind of stuff. And then they will the other ones who just kind of refused to talk to me and were really horrible about me and Sydney friends, let me that kind of stuff. So I just don't want to kind of go through that again, with Jean de
[00:15:37] go.
[00:15:40] lagoda, all girls school. So that's, you know, twist skirts and stuff. And that's not really good on days that I don't, like, just can't wear skirt. And I'll use my own name and, you know, female pronouns and all that kind of stuff. But again, I've just kind of learned to accept it there. I run a QSI Moscow and some of the girls that come to the Q si also attend the group, the community QSI, in which I'm known by a different name that I have at school, so that's difficult. I have to kind of come out to them whenever they come along there and it's confusing, and you say why I feel like I'm living a double life. It's, um, I guess it's, it'll be a lot easier when I can leave and just just use whatever name and everything works for me.