Sue and Berry - Older Lesbians

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[00:00:00] This program is brought to you by pride in [00:00:05] I don't know whether you look happily Think of yourself as old or older or elder lesbians is that? Does that feel right? Yeah. [00:00:17] I thought you're rich. We've reached the age where we feel we've got to start preparing for old age. But I'm 74. And I'm not old yet. [00:00:25] Absolutely. That's fantastic. what it's [00:00:28] about, it's about thinking ahead. Really the same way everyone history [00:00:33] 74 used to be old. isn't anymore all, which is absolutely terrific. [00:00:40] But I think you're a bit younger, I'm sure, sir. [00:00:43] I'm 65. And but it's interesting that we talked about that as different from my mother's generation. And, and different from Sydney, different from the straight community that I was in before we were sitting with at all. So the 65 I feel, quite often, if I put myself in the place I was in the place I am that's quite experimental. You know, it's not been done before. But I'm still working. So I get tired. Sean, I heavily CPG. [00:01:14] You know, there are all sorts of things. Because I'm still working and holding down a job that takes quite a bit of energy. But it's good. It's good, but it's different. [00:01:24] Is your paid work? How much of a week [00:01:27] is any part time? [00:01:30] So generally, if I'm lucky, I hit monday and friday off of that planet? Well, [00:01:34] but you want to have enough energy left for other activities? This presumably I mean, what are the sorts of things more likely to do apart from paid work together? And or separately? [00:01:47] We simple and let me answer all the all the questions. [00:01:52] We would definitely both be singing in the gamified. [00:01:56] I probably would still say in the company choir, with different maybe our home banks during that sort of stuff more. So the word thing doesn't picked on us energy levels? Yeah, [00:02:08] definitely. [00:02:09] So you can only do a subset of their terms. And she wanted to presume that means you're get to do more of them when you do get older. And if you manage to do this paper, I mean, you're not going to go onto paper forever. [00:02:21] I don't really, I don't really want to sort of stop work before. I'm 70. Because I love what I do this the first thing, the first thing is I love what I do. The second thing was I didn't go for marriage settlement lots of years ago, because of the situation I was at the time coming out as lesbian and not wanting that to in those days. And [00:02:47] how do I put this? [00:02:49] The impact on my children? This is not necessarily right. That's where I was faking, the impact on my children would have been so great. So we're saying this morning, we went to the lawyers of head icon for marriage settlement that was fitting and fear, we will be in a completely different situation now, in probably I might just work two days a week, because I love it. [00:03:11] So I didn't you mean you didn't play him as [00:03:13] much? You know, no, no, nothing? No, not at all. [00:03:15] Why? Why did was that a matter of your kids, it was [00:03:18] about my kids, it was about having my children taken off me ahead. [00:03:25] And I'd lost my family. And I just thought that that was too hard to do the next step and know that and believe at the time that I probably might lose them all forever, because I still hold on to the hype. [00:03:38] So the more money you you might have lost, [00:03:41] irretrievable damage in terms of relationships. [00:03:46] You're back seeing more of your children [00:03:48] very close, they came back to earth and returned to me and said they weren't going to be taken away. The third took lots of years, quite a few years. But [00:03:58] but so that stopped me there the impact of coming out as lesbian is against I think, a relationship that breaks up the heterosexual relationship that breaks up even if the wife runs away with another fellow or his another relationship with another fellow and time and that becomes quite acceptable, but not run away. Not from rural New Zealand. Yeah. [00:04:22] Did you have similar experiences when you're married to with kids? I was married [00:04:27] with kids. And I think probably the biggest impact for my children was that they were required to keep secret. That what I was doing what I was who I was, because there was so much shame attached to it was so much discrimination was particularly over it at the time, what [00:04:51] sort of years would be [00:04:54] seen it? [00:04:56] Right? Yours was similar time or not, too? [00:05:01] You know, 1990? I suppose? Yes. Yeah. [00:05:06] So it was very scary. And, and all my friendships were around straight couples. Yeah, [00:05:16] it was very scary. [00:05:19] But you to have a lot of contact with your [00:05:23] I are we're both very integrated with our families now. [00:05:26] And you both got grandchildren. So yeah. [00:05:31] And so that facet of as you get older is more similar to heterosexual people in the sense that you've got lots of family. [00:05:45] Do you think this, I don't know how long you've been together? Now, you didn't come [00:05:49] out and you came at spirit. And you kind of said, we've been together? 10 years, 11 years, they've [00:05:54] given us some reasonable time, but obviously, quite a long time after you came out [00:06:01] this episode? And [00:06:05] do you feel that somewhere where you're more similar with heterosexuals, and that you've got these big, extended families downwards? Apart from any siblings and so on? But do you feel that being a lesbian couple together aging, you know, does that have any impact particular that's different from I mean, you have you weren't aging when you have sexual, so it's hard to say, Man, what there anything you can put your fingers on around how aging as a couple lesbians has had an impact was different. [00:06:38] And I could go down all sorts of tracks. I mean, I will come back to the children. But even the impact of our lives the other banana, for instance, my life was rural New Zealand high profile. But if we go back then back a bit, we go back, for instance, there are one or two family some still place to have a wheezing from since we've just had to come up with a sort of a recipe. Now we don't do some of those things together, I'll go on my own. [00:07:08] There's no doubt in my head at all that of Barry was very, it would be quite different to go back into rural communities are waiting that they're still very nice and very nice people and very gracious, but it's very hard to cut through. And they know you're in [00:07:26] too much effort for both of you just go together. It's [00:07:29] just really hard. People don't know what to say to Barry. So they just say hello, Barry. And then talk to me. Lovely to meet you, sir. And then yeah, so that's that's quite max. You know, we've had to come up with all sorts of it's been quite hard, isn't it? Yeah. It goes both ways. Yeah. [00:07:45] With your woman with your Yeah. [00:07:48] Our family's very accepting of us as a couple and they pay us. [00:07:55] But they've come a long way since they have also come a long way since we came out. [00:08:02] And the world has changed some large [00:08:06] thanks to people who've been out all the time. So yeah, [00:08:11] but there are still we are still careful. [00:08:18] Who we come out to mostly that it wasn't a big deal, but we're still here. It's still a new consciousness, whether it's safe. Yeah. [00:08:30] The other thing is to we've got different politics. And politically from them I challenge [00:08:36] from from our [00:08:37] children. Yeah, so and so my politics are quite different. And they started years ago when I just decided as a family lifestyle of doing some sociology papers that may seem because I felt down. So that changed my life, but didn't change the lives of everyone around me. And now my children and my have got children. It's really interesting. So how your politics politics are different because for instance, particularly around feminine masculine and what will be little girls and what will be little boys and how we dress them and what we value and the dolls and the way the dolls are treated, and make up bureaus at preschool. So it's a strong feminist absolute, against my part of my feminine politics. So say that I'm sleep better, but I'm speaking I feel I just don't know what you do with it. You know, extraordinary Imagine that. And you fit and special. You talk about your money you. [00:09:40] One of them, one of my daughters was desperate to have a daughter She sounds a little girl for Christmas. One year got a stick. [00:09:55] dressing table bureau toy and makeup drawer. What's up? Had Butch had makeup in the bag. Mariah hairbrush knows the whole treatment that Charles had a history since she was very little. That's and she's a highly intelligent, very capable little girl was, you know, take on Nash as well. But yeah, it's [00:10:22] interesting the way that the next generation can offer rebel. I mean, if you will, feminist a lot. I believe so. [00:10:31] Yes, I think so. I think back on the other hand, I think the fact that your feminist lesbian feminists, means it's easy for them to get up. There she goes again. Yeah. So they've got an out. And that happens over and over again. around women shaving the genitals so you know what you can imagine some of the things we stand up on hind legs and say, and there they go again. D Oh, there she goes. Again, here. [00:10:59] So you went You said you wanted to go back to your children? Was this sort of thing you were going to talk about or something else? [00:11:05] Now? No, no big you can use this sort of thing was exactly the if it's because it's one of the things that I mean, it's we just have to show them as and be lovingly accept and [00:11:15] to suck it [00:11:16] to some extent. I mean, they've lovingly accept with us and not they're not for that reason, but we do but and also work out what you're going to say carefully. Yeah. [00:11:25] requires a certain amount of diplomacy. Yeah. And [00:11:32] closed mouth. [00:11:34] And obviously with big fatness, your blood family have to take a lot of your time, but you do have lesbian family, lesbian community as well there too. Yeah, [00:11:44] about that. [00:11:46] That's what keeps us sane, actually, doesn't it? Yeah. [00:11:48] And I think as we get older, those people, that community of friends becomes more and more. [00:11:55] This is what you can generally hear. Because this is very, very much so for us. You know, we sometimes come back and we just go Oh, thank God, you're here to at least be in good friends. I mean, [00:12:07] someone like me, who has virtually no blood family in New Zealand has been here. Yeah. You know, I don't even have to appreciate it because it's there for me most of the time. Yeah. I'm lucky in in a while here. Yeah, of course. Nobody regrets having kids. [00:12:23] And my partner has has one one some sadly a daughter that died but but not much family. So she doesn't have those same problems with grandchildren. So we're really probably in a different position where we can be with our listening family most of the time. [00:12:41] But I think I have a lot of people say what [00:12:44] a lovely feeling of just [00:12:47] the bond that people have most of us have been through a similar process to each other not the same but similar. So most of us know that have come out under difficult circumstances know, the terrific. Thanks attached to their [00:13:03] pain. And yeah, [00:13:04] very much almost everybody is paying attention coming out here. And then the early day, so it's lovely to see everyone we just know that of each other, don't we? Yeah, yeah, [00:13:16] we know each other in a way we didn't. I think that we didn't know if we're sexual friends, we were married. [00:13:25] And even for those of us who like me came out much younger and didn't have the issues of [00:13:33] being in a heterosexual marriage or anything. You still had those things my was that in the 60s so I took my mother to a very good [00:13:42] community us message [00:13:43] and I knew the courageous one [00:13:49] it's definitely the case some of [00:13:51] its watching know when we [00:13:53] Yeah, we used to get I think they both had examples of an early days people not you but people like you sort of making sure we know and feeling quite resentful that you've paved the way for us to come out [00:14:07] Well, certainly I mean, real pioneers who who have I mean, I came out was a sports lesbian and what didn't get the politics so much into later Yeah, political people did circle and so on. Yeah. [00:14:25] Now what about the business of of just living as you get older and the issues you face and whether or not they're associated with being lesbian? I mean, we all have to face health money and soul issues. Is there anything around that shoot [00:14:44] we're going to be buried [00:14:47] together [00:14:49] or not? [00:14:51] I mean, that's that's a bigger one. I don't know if it's bigger than that. Those sorts of issues. Bring me back to spirituality spiritual issues, and they've changed for me hugely and I'm still sitting there and I and I benefit no woman's land picking up what the next day but I think that happens quite a lot of us to you know, for me it was different for yet from you, you could you brought up Jewish Yeah, yeah, whereas for me, I I was brought up. I played the organ every Sunday in an Anglican Church and weddings and funerals and so Anglicanism was just who I was and took children's choirs and you know if I haven't found and and Billy's been coming out as a lesbian didn't need to impact on edit all accepted dead Dead [00:15:41] Can you say at all how [00:15:44] are we I guess the beginning of it was [00:15:49] the beginning of it was around [00:15:54] feeling judged and being judged and feeling a loss of made of the chips family and I did but that's nothing to do with it now that one has to do with it now as that event actually believe or Let's stop I used to believe it I've got a different take on things but don't know if that's even relevant for now. [00:16:13] Why is it an issue for you now? [00:16:16] Because I can't because it's really comfortable and nice. It's there's a comfortable nervous along about going somewhere and singing the wonderful music and you do it actually. [00:16:25] I talk about singing Jewish on Saturdays from Christian on Monday [00:16:31] and I just regarded like listenership you know that. [00:16:36] Like you can read the Bible or whatever, as as literature I can sing [00:16:42] this a good [00:16:47] laugh together with Wiggin out gives me the hardest things that we could ever have to end up and see the notes or anywhere like they're sitting amongst a group of people who are all hit for sexual. I used to think that we both did with visit my mother over in Macedonia and one in we used to think how alone and lonely Wouldn't it just be the absolute end? If that's what happened? [00:17:10] And I think that we assume and think we've experienced in those places that there's an assumption officer sexuality. So you're always up against that assumption. [00:17:22] Absolutely. And that's why why some people are trying to set up lesbian villages. [00:17:27] Totally, absolutely. [00:17:30] But ideally, you would like to [00:17:33] stay here in your beautiful house [00:17:35] around it as long as you possibly could. Absolutely and then when we're hobbling on merge he is bad at little place next door so we're in the same street and have all their lovely little flats around the corner that other nice beings and have a little enclave or by the beach or something, [00:17:50] but not there. Wouldn't that be one here? What more the same for pocket [00:17:55] to pack your recovery here if you found something? Yeah, yeah, we just can't afford it. [00:18:01] me know. That's the other problem. It's whether the issues of health and and finance and so on the flooded ones. And I mean, we're probably looking at this house and no mind we're in must be in better places financially than some This is there's no short says no, that's fine. That's fine. Have you done any thinking ahead about bonus money issues? [00:18:26] With put in the left? [00:18:29] For your wheelchair? Yeah. [00:18:31] When you set out the last season with it. [00:18:34] Oh, you're gonna have arrived? Not shortly. Oh, [00:18:37] fantastic. Yeah, [00:18:38] yes. Those a cynic brings up all our firewood and into the house without groceries. You [00:18:45] suitcases are for traveling. [00:18:49] Wonderful. Yeah. So that's made us feel confident to stay on here? [00:18:55] Because you both had some health issues. Yeah. Yeah. [00:19:02] Who [00:19:02] we hope not? Well, I've only had joined her shoes. So just get them replaced. Yeah. [00:19:13] And every month that I get away from, you know, every month is free. And I was a month before so. But our main issues working out how you know, you'd be the same. You've got a certain amount of money saved. How long is it going to last you before? You've got to leave this place? Yeah. We'll leave your place. [00:19:32] Yes, well, I haven't had dependent. So I'm hoping the answer is never but it isn't necessarily for everybody. It's how to arrange things, if possible. [00:19:43] I mean, this thing was like reverse mortgages. [00:19:46] For about but [00:19:48] we have I had someone was saying the other day they put such a lot of [00:19:52] music is not geared up well, [00:19:55] which is a pity. But it is possible if [00:19:58] if as well. So my I'm innocuous This is a general this year, he is not exclusively lesbian, but we're making sure our children know what we want. And don't anticipate a wonderful when we die. Yeah, because we feel absolutely free to spend whatever we've got remainder [00:20:18] will say we have to if we want to stay in our lifestyle and do what we're doing and sit here haven't kept up with Prue home. [00:20:28] We need money. Yeah. [00:20:30] And it sounds just as long shouldn't be presumably, I mean, some couples, heterosexual or lesbian or gay, I don't know about gay men, I mean, sort of have some assumption that their kids will look after them when they get older on the one hand, and kids have expectations for money on the other hand, and in fact, you can't be sure about either [00:20:55] exactly the truth and really have any expectation that they have to look after I say it all do them. Well, I think that they know your drivers probably will be there for you and your son [00:21:08] Walter have to be [00:21:12] never, never make an assumption on one of my sons will cease to look after you. And they can. But I don't want to make that assumption. That's Yeah. [00:21:28] Now you talked about how you you know, because you're still working you don't have as much singing and when to other things you want what what are we other other activities you want to do more of as you as you get older and maybe have more time but on the other hand, we will slow down if [00:21:50] you [00:21:52] want mostly amuse its music, my musical attaching things attached to the beach. But also [00:22:01] when we live we [00:22:02] live see you and sit down. This is absolutely lovely. You know, and and actually, because our social life has shrunk and it's on purpose used to be far too big, it's shrunk. And some of its wrapped around the fact that I'm still working. And it makes it sound like a beard and that's not that's because I love it and we choose it and Barry still does some of your things. [00:22:25] But I think most of us will be having the joy of mentioned today pre we could have run out you ambassadors from Tippett's a lovely day. Let's hop on our backs and meet some halfway and have a thermos of tea. That sort of thing. This community. Yeah, they actually speaking community and that sort of thing that I really hope happens. [00:22:45] What about other things? I mean, do you want to travel or [00:22:49] anything like that more? [00:22:51] I'm not fussed about there. I love it. [00:22:56] I love it. But since then, and muscle, not particularly lesbian either. But I wanted to travel on fire other festivals. So battles, I would be taken to pick a piece out of the pie. [00:23:11] That's very much in there. Yeah. So trampolines theory on the back burner. [00:23:18] And I think it's what it is, I think it's absolutely so it became quite psychological. Now inside me like we won't be doing that. Because we did a big trip last year, and another big one the year before the year or two years before there. [00:23:33] And they cost a huge amount of money they did that is actually not feasible now. And we might do things like be big and brave and go to Australia, or to the islands. But we haven't got the money. We're just not resourced enough to even think back that process gone. Yeah. So you had your last two big waves basically. Yeah. Yeah. And we just know. [00:23:58] And now we've just hit it. One, my children and family have just settled here. They're just come over from Europe, unexpectedly and they've settled here. So we actually haven't haven't got any children or close mates or anyone over the other side of the world to pull us over the like, you've still got your your connections, the spatial connections, we don't I don't need a [00:24:21] year and a half years. Yeah. [00:24:27] And no way but at least in New Zealand, yeah. [00:24:31] And no sisters or brothers or I mean, you've got strong connections over the store. Give me [00:24:37] just a bit [00:24:39] more friends, one brother in America otherwise friends, but yeah, but you know, because I didn't have dependents. I guess I've I can still do it. Yeah, yeah. And, [00:24:50] and what about Do you ever think at all? I mean, as you say, you don't feel old is, you know, we hope we've all got lots of years to go. But do you ever think about about you know, afterwards? And how will you be remembered or and he want to be remembered by or? I mean, you've got the kids, of course. So you have automatic? [00:25:11] People remember you? [00:25:14] I hate to think that my mom, the women on my mother's side of the family, right? big, strong women, with stories to tell pioneering women and lots of ways with stories to tell. [00:25:29] In some ways, and my family, you could say I'm a pioneering woman that have done things that haven't been done before, because certainly we think now that was probably at least being played us. And, [00:25:43] and gay ankle, and the South Island. So what am I doing about it? nothing except that, how are we going to be remembered? Because we need to be remembered that so and Barry, we're a partnership and soon as an ESPN? Yes. And we need to be ready. But I don't I mean, some of it. I'm wondering, like I've got this big new project that I'm setting in this room with a big pile of canvas on the floor, and I'm going to whittle, I'm going to put a tear in this room into a wood cabin. And I want to make the totem pole because been to see lm waivers name is looking for a tutor and he said to go to baby, because I want someone to teach me how to insert Yeah, and part of it is I want to have asked won't be all the children that will be beer in May and cavity and the mountains. We have left something on it. That's going to be a statement that and I've got that fan. [00:26:38] So I'm looking for you as a couple of [00:26:41] cities. Yeah, [00:26:43] absolutely. That's a legacy. [00:26:46] And God. [00:26:49] Yes, that's right. She might [00:26:51] want to write something to go with it. It sounds like you know, you want to be remembered as the capital. I often wonder whether people want to write mini autobiography publication. So a lot more people are doing oral history of their families. [00:27:09] Just I think it'd be a good conversation to continue extranet [00:27:16] a family [00:27:17] of strong women. My mom was, she was at my age protesting against the Springbok turn 1980 something she belonged to an organization called so his sister. So indeed, abortion [00:27:33] rights, some shows one of Australia's [00:27:37] fascinating mother. [00:27:38] She was a very, she got a degree at a time when women didn't go to university. What was her name? My long. [00:27:47] Oh, yes. I didn't even realize there you go. [00:27:52] She worked in a university library for years. Yeah. [00:27:54] I didn't even know she was your mother. [00:27:58] So she was she was? Yeah. [00:28:02] And she was quite radical, wasn't she? She was theory [00:28:05] independent thinking is was her mother. Yeah. She is she was she had to get house trained dad was very consumer. [00:28:17] Just thinking of legacies and being remembered, of course, as you mentioned, your ongoing activities. And one of those is that you're a celebrant, of course. So you've been involved with other people's sort of been talked about you you've done one or two at least lesbian funerals. Have [00:28:34] you done a few civil unions? Yeah, [00:28:39] it's that's a very special thing to do. It feels incredibly privileged to be [00:28:47] facilitating, I suppose for one of a better word, but to be such an integral part of a huge event in somebody's life. And I love it. Yeah, [00:28:57] and certainly the lesbian funeral our mentioned the day that we talked a little bit before we started this tape, which is a friend of mine, who you decline for, but she was not very out. But there was still just enough stuff around her being a strong woman. And I think probably I, I had to turn at the ceremony because I can't help. [00:29:20] She asked you to speak so she asked. [00:29:25] But have you done one for any really artists been? [00:29:30] probably will. [00:29:32] But it was a very interesting experience, planning that funeral because she was very involved. And not herself. Having the ceremony was how she wanted it. Yes. Which was really nice. It was nice to know that she got what she wanted. [00:29:52] And she was Satoshi involved with women, not me to her family. But she she had she had a lovely. Yes, he was out just as a gay man. And she herself had been involved in sports teams and was very, very good. [00:30:12] Trash. Yeah. The [00:30:15] experience is probably different for people like us who are not that out. [00:30:20] To be one of them do [00:30:30] be a challenge. [00:30:32] We make quite a few conversations about what the hell we're going to do about that. And what that's going to look like and [00:30:41] if anything you want. [00:30:43] About there? [00:30:44] Well, because it's this family [00:30:46] like schizophrenia Exactly. You've got the two and and us to least be in a family and we are in the middle of that. We're part of age. And lesbian funeral, or celebration that we imagine is out these beings would be one that would be five brackets, I think. Yeah. I think it'd be very fun for our kids now and the kids have gone through a process with us. [00:31:13] Certainly, there's [00:31:14] been there been plenty where the combinations work to like Bronwyn, Dean Judith day. [00:31:21] live very close, very close to and the families were good about everything. There. They were very heavily and lesbian funerals as well. [00:31:30] So I think the difficulty is certainly in my case, my children don't know. Very many news being Prince. Look here. [00:31:38] Yes. Come across them. Yeah. [00:31:40] Where's your cats have had more chance to tonight. So if your friends so it would probably be a little bit like a New Zealand party with me around the bag woman. [00:31:56] We expect to have a buddy who wants to be [00:32:00] I need to prepare themselves. [00:32:02] And to speak, when to speak. Yeah. [00:32:07] So what you meant to me? [00:32:09] Yes, exactly. Yeah. [00:32:13] I think you should have actually should have a joint white long before your acid. [00:32:19] This frenzy, as well as it was, [00:32:22] it was but she didn't want any speeches or anything. It's just a party really wasn't it? [00:32:30] really sort of, she was very at peace with the fact that she was dying. [00:32:35] That was an amazing one. Because it was so fast. I mean, she had many days illness. And then suddenly, she had a bad day within three or four months. And she was amazing. [00:32:47] She said, I've had a really good life, and I have no regrets. And I'm ready. [00:32:53] For that, that's the other thing that we need to do for our children. Because Michael just been through that with their own father bear with a father, who died very suddenly. So they had to sort it all out. [00:33:09] Because we're always saying to apps, you've got to get clarity about your wills. And you've got to get clarity about how you might be. Yeah. [00:33:19] And following along that business about us afterwards. And what we leave the legacy just we couldn't really we've got two funerals and things. But actually the most, the most significant or most important thing would be that we're either being ashes put some money together or buried next door to each other with a with something that the see is [00:33:42] Barry, and so partner, lifelong partner or whatever. Absolutely. That's what has to happen. It actually isn't that what we know [00:33:53] everything. I mean, that's the in the newspaper. Yes. Yes, announcement [00:33:59] accepted, because it's sad when when it isn't like that. I've just had one in the cricket community, where the much older partner died. And it was just, you know, lifelong friend or something. [00:34:13] sad when [00:34:15] it's also part of [00:34:18] a sense of insecurity around the public. Yeah, [00:34:22] he thought it was something lovely that happened when my mother died last year. Remember that my motherhood had such a struggle. And the towards the end of a knife grief hugely attached to bury, and the person in my family that knew that was my sister. And when it came to putting the death notice in the paper, that was going to be very formal, and she was the like, bloody, Bloody Bloody, and then that came to bury. And there was a bit of hesitation around it. And my sister was the one during the day. She just said, She's partner of Susan, that's what's to go on the paper. Well, so bear patter of Suan sit, lots of people commented on it. It was a real okay for us. And my family [00:35:06] was for a family that has to start cooking. So yeah, concert here. [00:35:12] Yes, really cool. It was absolutely amazing. And we expected a big backlash from other members of the family. [00:35:20] Know, just thinking we must remember that. Yes, here we live together alongside each other in whatever shape or form. [00:35:27] I think all three conversations I've had, there's been somebody who Oh, yes, that's a good idea. [00:35:33] Which is a nice. [00:35:37] I sort of can't think of anything, particularly as I want to ask you, but if you've got any thoughts, any more thoughts about any [00:35:45] other [00:35:46] words that we think about in which we believe things Bry? [00:35:51] know that it was worth it? But for sure about next of kin? fear in hospital is who's your next of kin? And do you prove it? When it's a natural assumption assumption if you're married? Yes. That your marriage partners, your next opponent? That's, you know, they have to convince the hospital staff. [00:36:12] Yes, I mean, I think that's a very serious one. I mean, I'm at any age I remember when I was partners with [00:36:20] Bronwyn and she got it all quite young and, and things happened like actually cuff crossing out next of kin partner or something and putting friend kept crossing our friend now, they're not meant to do that anymore. But a lot of people aren't in the world [00:36:38] because of their own beliefs. Yeah, [00:36:43] yes, we do have to watch the movie actually. And you can see that that could happen because there are little pockets in the family already, for instance, and my family who sometimes unknown the screen to the children, so some of them are walking and say, Hey, his grandson, Barry's house, monetarism coming on to his green suit house, his green suit. It's true isn't very Yeah. So let's just one step of would be quite easy and you just got to protect yourself from that. That's [00:37:14] because it's quite a big and I mean, if you don't have things very clear that if one member of your family is not too good, they can convince up an authority hospital bed that daughter or Sam or whatever is the main person not you. Yeah. Yeah, that's great. You've got the powers of attorney in the thing that she can produce [00:37:36] quite a while ago. [00:37:44] Well, let's hope none of this is relevant. [00:37:49] Because we can get those backgrounds on the beat genetic cover. [00:37:55] Well, thank you very much for for talking to me today. It's been very pleasant experience for me. [00:38:05] It's been very thought provoking

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