From Bisexual to Skoliosexual - Proud 2016

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[00:00:00] This podcast is brought to you by the Elgar Oceania rainbow human rights and health conference, and pride [00:00:10] So I'm Melissa, and with this workshop, we did have some ideas of how we could like present information. But then To be honest, I personally thought, well, that's not the best idea for me, because I still have so much to learn. And this is my first private event, I was thrown out what thanks for that, I think, you know, it's going to be very much like a collaborative discussion based workshop, sharing personal experiences, if you feel comfortable to do so. In things that like affected you and your journey, to where you are now, wherever that may be. and lively talking about how and I think that was like a consistent theme this morning, as well, we can make sure that the sort of more and we've been referring to them and our planning is ignored identities are included far more in the community and how we can more interest as well that we reached out to people who do identify with those different identities and how we can make sure that they get invited in as opposed to just kind of going along with sitting here waiting. Because that's just so doesn't work. And so just really came to hear from everyone, some action points of what each of us could maybe take away personally to our friend groups and family groups, but also in terms of like our wider networks, be at work or, you know, volunteer groups, and how we can make sure that we really provide that information as well for young questioning people who might be struggling, particularly because there's a lack of resource or education around those identities. Yeah. All right, Georgia start like with a round of introductions of everyone, the first thing [00:01:44] would have put this we're just sort of establish a rough sort of coca into social, this is a safe space. [00:01:52] For us, I think just like the basics work sitting here stays in here protecting your finances, opinions. [00:01:58] And friends online. Does anyone else have anything pressing that they feel needs to be issued? Like said, as a Copa? No, [00:02:07] I just wondering would be, if you're aware that you're someone that likes to talk [00:02:11] quite a lot, [00:02:12] that just remember that there [00:02:14] are other people who might find it. Interesting. Yeah. [00:02:19] So the first thing we're going to do is maybe draw into like the sexuality spectrum. And we can sort of talk about that, because I thought, well, learning different identities of each other, which is a great stat. So we just use the whiteboard. [00:02:34] Yeah. [00:02:38] So how I sort of started to make it [00:02:42] was it on one side is very. [00:02:47] And then on the other side, it's very, [00:02:57] got like, a, [00:03:00] and then we've got like, a romanticism down at the bottom. [00:03:08] And so then it's kind of like escape from between all those things. And there's a range of identities that all fit in different parts of this, I think, and then, as also as sort of the idea that it's very fluid. Sometimes you may feel very, like suicide, and right here in the center, then other times, you might feel very much more identify, you know, and so in the middle, that's, as a group, we get discussed different identities. [00:03:37] Yeah. [00:03:40] I don't think this comes as diverse genders. Because how do you define a [00:03:51] sexual person [00:03:55] they relate to relationship is neither a triple homosexual. [00:04:00] It's the center. So we've got Mike from a very access point of view. And then right, and then this is also access point of view. But like, same sex, two, opposite sex. But then in the middle, this is where like, picture would be. Bye, bye. [00:04:19] Yeah. But those are sexual orientation is not gender. [00:04:28] identity. Yeah. But they different later or under six. And I think that's the thing. Is that on itself or something? [00:04:38] We need like a 3d [00:04:42] plane that sits on top of that plane. Yeah, exactly. [00:04:44] before receiving is a 3d image. Maybe you probably do need to figure one. [00:04:52] Yeah. Yeah. So yeah. [00:04:58] Like, [00:05:03] trends in like non binary, [00:05:06] like things such as described? So like, I shouldn't, [00:05:11] you know, like, [00:05:14] it's impossible to [00:05:17] spherical fun. So yes. [00:05:18] Because I, my plan is that what we've always done is if I can education, when your view isn't always sort of gone, hatred, karma, and wouldn't even look at anything around that will just look in line. And hoping that through this workshop, we can come up with a clear plan. And we can do like two kids like, Look, it's not just a straight line is literally, I [00:05:43] think, as well. And this is where like I particularly struggle, like with mental health, and just with like, my own, like little experience is that if people and this is something that like I think fits with your like by or pen, or if you identify it as something which is more fluid, as people will look at my relationship and go, Oh, you're in a relationship, you have a boyfriend, realistically, on most given days, I am way more over here. It's just that I actually happened to connect with an assistant, a male. And I think that makes it really difficult in terms of like, your personal identity, and, you know, and if I refer to myself as queer or something like that, and people kind of look at me, and they're like, but I you, you know, and I'm like, Yes. [00:06:31] Yeah, what are you saying? Yeah, your experience is [00:06:33] the same. It's, it's people are like, Yeah, but no, you're not because you're in a [00:06:40] relationship with a guy. So [00:06:42] yeah, yeah. And I think that's something which we'll talk about later on the workshop as well. But like how to, like, maybe have conversations with partners and family around it, because that's something that, you know, and to be honest, I'm really wanting to learn of other people as well, because I've had, I've had no support network in terms of that. And so when I started dating my boyfriend, I was like, Look, we have to have a conversation. Because he totally knew that I am queer, but I was like, you have to not just accept us, but celebrate it. You know, and just how you have those different conversations as well, as something that we can come through? [00:07:16] How do you find? So we're talking about acceptance of general society? and saying, oh, much better if you've got a, if you're in a hetero relationship in, we'd find us there. But it's also quite excluding in the LGBT? [00:07:35] Absolutely. And I mean, because [00:07:39] there'll be people who go [00:07:42] in, it's a bit about, like, [00:07:48] feeling more entitled, I think like, because [00:07:54] if if you've got a [00:07:58] visible gender identity, you've got a really obvious sexual orientation that, that you don't have any flexibility in there. In your be, you may have different struggles. I mean, yeah. [00:08:18] And, and I wonder if you have had that kind of [00:08:22] being ostracized from the LGBT community, because of people who might say, well, you can just hide it. [00:08:30] Totally, that's really a thing as people have like a lot of [00:08:34] sort of this idea of passing almost. Which I think though, for me, I just see that as actually a ratio of my identity. And it's something that for a long time. [00:08:49] And I'm gonna be real brief, because I want to be done physically. But like, for a long time, I really struggled with as well, because I dated a girl in high school. And then when I left high school, I had like three boyfriends in a row. And so we're on the street. Oh, it's just a face on like, she was this white guy for a year. You know, and so I actually posted like, a profile picture was like, actually, no, I'm bisexual. And these are like, a bunch of like, the myths which I really wanted to spell. But it is definitely [00:09:18] that was really nervous. I actually turned my laptop off for like, half an hour afterwards. And I was like, Nah, I'm just gonna let this [00:09:25] Yeah, um, but no, totally. And I think so. It's something that I'm still trying to write about. Because I think it's so like, on one hand, you can't just say to someone, Oh, you don't quit your anymore because you're in that relationship. But at the same time, you know, I do actually accept that, like, you know, I can walk down the street holding my partner's hand. I wasn't, didn't used to, you know, but I can now, but it's realizing that as well. And kind of going, No, actually, I do really understand. Especially I think sometimes like it comes out of a hurt us. So people who, like you know, want the same thing. Yeah, but that's a really interesting point in discussion. You have any ideas on it? Yeah. Anyone? Yeah. [00:10:15] Yeah, I feel kind of cemented. It does, like, I think affect my identity. And sometimes even I'm like, what was that phase? was like, I've been in a relationship with him two years now. So I'm like, Well, I don't know, perhaps if, if I felt more supported by the community, I might celebrate my own identity a little bit. Totally. Yeah. [00:10:37] Sorry. Just one. [00:10:40] Lecture. The next thing I was [00:10:43] wondering, what have you looked at it says that then we took this way, and we put them in a separate line, and we put in male and female, or, like, CES nonsense. [00:11:00] In a romantic of opposites. [00:11:07] A romantic [00:11:09] there's never meant a connection, people that just say show me attractive. [00:11:15] So and you know, I sort of saw them as opposites. Because one was, like romance. One was sexual. But it wasn't a show. That was an assumption, which I probably shouldn't have done. But we have a discussion about the [00:11:35] origin of sin, Christian. Nice, nice. [00:11:40] and nice. And also, Can one of you please explain what is what does Iceman [00:11:48] so he is a fiction outline. Yeah, yeah. Explain it. [00:11:53] For him. Right. [00:11:57] Good. Christian. Yeah, we all have that Christian. [00:12:03] Because you can't, you don't have to come opposite of a sexual, sexual and then you have another one for a romantic and remember it. [00:12:12] So yeah. because [00:12:16] too many things. [00:12:19] Yeah, like a sexual sexual. [00:12:22] A romantic, romantic, I think I've always thought of sexuality, the sphere is even better than I was drawing a big circle, and everyone's got summer. And that's so cool. Everybody's probably a little bit different than everybody else. [00:12:33] That's what we [00:12:35] met Mr. Lee, if you get it perfect, which paradigms but everyone is, you know, as long as they perhaps they will label this [00:12:49] diagram, [00:12:49] we need one of those [00:12:52] holograms. [00:13:00] Anyone else seen just like, while we were talking about it before, like, it's sort of, in our minds, has anyone experienced being in a relationship that maybe doesn't make visible like the entirety of your identity, and therefore, like, have dealt with assumptions or stereotypes and things? [00:13:17] I think, from an era men, in a sexual perspective, people don't really appreciate the importance of the close friendships that you make. And they think, you know, if you have a Platonic friendship with somebody of a different gender, that they will think, you know, why are you? Why are you having sex six. And particularly, I suppose, it's also difficult that there are really very few in the wider body, very few a sexual people, so the chance of two of them meeting each other, and understand each other's whereas a sexual person made me to a sexual person, not and not understand them, and want to have a relationship with them, and feel really hurt. [00:14:14] I think that it's interesting, because, and I'm kind of different my sexual Facebook groups, and internationally, [00:14:22] there's only 7000, like people and one of them. [00:14:24] That's like the biggest. So that's an international Facebook type. And that's like the first thing when you type into Facebook that will come up, which I think is really interesting. But I'm like, pretty sure that there is far more people, ya know, my plans this year, and I think Alex is going to work with me a little bit on it. And through inside out, I want to sit up, sat with probably a Facebook group, and then move into like, meetings monthly, but I can ignored sexual identity is nonsense lead into this, like growth? Because I'm sure that there are multiple identities. He's out there, but like, there's no visibility for it. Yeah. So I think the biggest issue is that there just isn't [00:15:08] the visibility. And it's something that we've been talking about in terms of like, one of the sort of discussion questions that we had was like, what sort of resources have been available, like to you like through your sort of Aquila journey, but that implies that his destination, it doesn't necessarily have to have a destination, you can just be moving along. Yes, you know, but just in terms of like, what information was available? Or like, have you seen available to people? Because, like, to be honest, bisexuality, I'm gonna like class that I like the feeling mainstream group, you know, in terms of like, ignored identities, because it was still, you know, something, that's why they talked about that my school counselor was like, are does that mean, you have a boyfriend and a girlfriend at the same time? Like, you are not the person I need to be talking to right now. [00:15:59] But it's in terms of, does anyone had like really positive experiences of education available? Or maybe not? Or just and, you know, thinking about that as well. Because I think in terms of, you know, [00:16:11] being ice and stuff, maybe it's just that a lot of people go on feeling like this, but yeah, maybe there's something wrong with me, or maybe, like, even like a thing, or what's just wrong with me, you know, get [00:16:21] this information that we know. [00:16:25] So things that people do totally erase the, the sexual identity and just say, or just because you can't get an opposite sex partner or any partner that they're just like, I was just because you're a loser. You know, it's it's net, it's human nature to want to have six. That's what the argument is. And so it's just completely array says that it's really hurtful as well. [00:16:59] How did you go about finding that information? [00:17:07] And it comes just looking. I don't know, it's not like, I didn't know what to Google. [00:17:13] That's what I'm saying. That was like, you know, [00:17:16] we found it through an article about something, [00:17:19] right? [00:17:20] Yeah. No, because I think that's often the problem as well particularly was ignored identities. As you know, if it's not actually talked about, or like, if the idea isn't presented to you kind of like that Facebook group that I said before, you know, someone might just be going, Oh, like, this is just a thing about me. And because it's, they really do think it's a something about them, they're not [00:17:40] going to sort of go ahead and look for that information. [00:17:43] Yeah, yeah, that was [00:17:44] like, for me was like, [00:17:46] figuring out my non binary consultants to like, I pretty much just assumed that when I didn't feel that I was a woman, that I must be dude, until I met other non binary people. Yes, sir. And because there was no language, there's no language for whitelist society. Generally, sir. Yes. Just that thing of and [00:18:08] yeah. [00:18:10] I don't know how you change that. [00:18:15] Anyone else? [00:18:18] Jason, what kind of like, you know, you're being a political party and things like do you have many educational resources, and if you don't, [00:18:28] so um, 12 years ago, we spent, we formed for four months trying to even put some definitions together. So tonight is your week we, in Australia GLBTI was being used. We, after three or four months of researchers have implanted with LGBT IQ. And we thought the Q covers the A passes. somebody does something he doesn't say a minute sign the whole letter thing is, and people didn't really understand maybe two years ago in the broader community, what all is meant. And we've actually had now everyone uses the LGBT IQ in Australia. And now there's the the eight classes being added a man in some ways as well. And I think that's been really good. So that now we spent 18 months researching what needed to happen for full inclusion and celebration of LGBT IQ people in Australia and live with 30 pages. And marriages, one paragraph, we don't have manageable. [00:19:34] We don't have adoption of 47. Seven, might say just passed in November. [00:19:40] We still had we only just recently had the decriminalization of people had sex offenders for engaging in same same sex was recently as well, last four months, [00:19:51] in some sites in Australia is only four years ago that you could [00:19:57] have the defense of someone came on to me [00:20:02] kill them get away with it. Good. So this [00:20:11] last question is not answered properly, I'm sorry, I don't want to [00:20:14] just in terms of educational results, and how you also keep them out to people who maybe are either already been raised [00:20:21] awareness and you've been educated. So our, our audience is 40%. heterosexual. And we believe our whole process of in education, so whether you go through our policy strategy was on our website, there's 30 pages of emotions about as positively written into. So it's almost like you implement all these things. And Australia is a fully inclusive, beautiful society, I understand that legislative change is not the same as social change. But they they took they connected. So it's all the way through, it's been an education process. You know, and in that, particular trends, issues have had a lot of focus in recent last year, so which is a good thing. And the fact that people are, you know, not easily defined, and it's okay, and there's nothing wrong with being everything is about education, everything. I just tried to learn, we actually went and just, you know, listen. And then the team is not just gay people, there were the broad spectrum. [00:21:30] And some straight people. So, [00:21:34] yeah, I'm just trying to think like a potential inside out as well. It was really good. Yeah, I'm just sort of, like, totally, I think this is stuff that we can work on as a group as how do we get like resources on like, you know, the sort of ignored identities or maybe like not so mainstream identities out to people, you know, to help them figure it out? [00:21:58] I'm saying, Yeah, [00:22:00] things that are outside the norm tumbles quite [00:22:03] a few. I was waiting for someone to write. [00:22:05] Because, because you don't have to know like, exact keywords you want. Because if you're like 66 year old, SEO, non conforming gender, and then because it takes things to categorize, and all this is what you might be looking for just a journey of like, I wasn't looking for that. But okay, you have a giant list and links to like articles. [00:22:28] It's pretty cool. [00:22:32] Actually, [00:22:36] that's [00:22:36] the biggest problem. And it [00:22:39] is the goal, what are the things in the future, but at the moment, it's like prioritizing what's urgent, and like what I've actually got about six hours to get funding for. So at the moment, we've done like, the had a support unit with the equivalent schools. That's because of accurate statistics, about half of the work. So it's easier to try and get funding even though we were turned down for funding. But, you know, so I think that the next plan [00:23:09] Schools program in Australia, [00:23:11] yes. [00:23:13] The all of us resource. Yeah. [00:23:16] It's been it's been candy. Yeah. [00:23:19] Not as a definitive hasn't been one weekend. But the federal government is investigating it now and they may withdraw its funding for it. In my state. The state government has a goal of having any funded in every school by 2018 Alright, so the different everywhere but there's the religious right are very much hung in there sexualized that completely and made it in Parliament, they've come out and said things that are pedophiles and, and they use the phrase payments hacking in and responding like there's somebody evil concoction that we're encouraging the other 90% to do and [00:24:05] this program is made a massive difference in public and private schools and last two and a half years. Hopefully it might be the federal government may actually can funding for it. We spend $1.2 billion every four years on Jacqueline's [00:24:21] family spent $8 million at the same time on the Safe Schools Program. 1.2 billion, 8 million. That's like, that's like a 1.2 billion you say friends? Yeah. I think just [00:24:36] for or let's go to [00:24:40] the sessions. [00:24:43] Schools. [00:24:45] public schools, public schools, right. Yes, [00:24:48] numbers, but how is their country defining itself as a religious state? So Nicholas, we just [00:24:54] had to really just right wing government? Yeah. That has to you know, them and I have too much fun. It's disgusting. What they say is disgusting. And there I was on in the audience for a TV show the other day and trans issues cannot be in relation, because it's really the stuff that's more salacious to the straight person is the trans stuff in the school in schools. But there was no trans voice in the audience once you know, and it was, it's wrong. [00:25:23] Yeah. I think the salient point is that these are things these are choices. I mean, my opinion, religion is right there with gender identity and sexual orientation, in terms of you have a choice to identify it [00:25:43] as a lifestyle choices to religious [00:25:45] Yeah, yeah. And therefore, you could one one side of the argument could be to say, Okay, if we're considering ourselves to be a secular state, then we won't teach religious. We won't have religious teachings in public schools. On the flip side, that, that gives the same reasoning to that's happening cheering, gender diversity in schools, and they'll say okay, yeah. So So either you could say, Okay, well, we should we should teach religious. We should have religious teachings in scope of all religions, so that people can inform themselves and truth. associated with [00:26:30] same, the same. Yeah, the same funding on [00:26:37] that's real good, I think somewhat like shifting it fit neurons, right. [00:26:43] I've got I was gonna say, [00:26:45] No, I think it's interesting, because I've always kind of gone like, Oh, this hates of resources. We don't need to get them out there. Like, [00:26:52] I just always assumed that was resources. One that if you haven't seen it, you should contact say schools and yeah, and get it because it's very, [00:27:00] yeah, I think what you said nice and about Tom was really interesting, because I think Yeah, a lot of people sort of have this idea of Tom well, but I actually think it is really, really good in terms of people exploring who they are, and figuring those things out. [00:27:17] Do you get much bigotry on me? [00:27:20] I think that that's [00:27:22] to [00:27:24] live site for that like a [00:27:25] totally [00:27:28] other people. [00:27:30] Yeah, it's very much almost like a community of people who, and then even people on there who identify as Lexus Tinder and straight. Like, there's just so much on there that I think if they really were to like try and even meaning, they actually would just get completely shut down. [00:27:49] by voting, right? You thumbs up or thumbs down it? [00:27:52] No. So you can just see the likely blog posts or you'd like them and yeah, yeah. And so like this, heaps of really cool blogs as well. So there's like one or like, being a sexual got [00:28:06] And lots of different things like that. But [00:28:10] most of all, because I run like a Yes, sorry. Also, that's where you get most of [00:28:16] what do you answer back to the previous and Hamilton? [00:28:24] I'm here because we're looking for resources for ice people. And I've got a couple of years ahead of me like you know what, we [00:28:33] don't do anything. look [00:28:41] like one book, and it was [00:28:43] a ship book. [00:28:49] Like your six year old? Basically, it was what I was like, [00:28:56] deal. [00:28:57] Silent tumbler, like, I just end the since you just sick. [00:29:04] And it can find people who have real life experience. And also they found the resources, the whitfill themselves, so they will build out the crap. Yeah, kind of thing. So they've kind of done the hard work for you. Yeah. And there's tons of pages just dedicated to it. Because, again, the probably pushing the awareness of like, well, I did this resource when I first got myself. [00:29:22] Yes, everyone else. Let's go. Let's go father. Yeah. So how do you guys think maybe, like, everyone as a group, could way? Because like, this is the thing is we're trying to look like as a community? How can we go back out to like our own networks, and really promote, like awareness and education on these things? And terms of resources not existing? Like, do you think we should just write them ourselves? Or do we just find like, really good ones and kind of like information share or [00:29:51] carry on? [00:29:52] would be kind of, if we find resources from overseas, that they're not necessarily going to be culturally appropriate here? Yeah. So that [00:30:00] could be an argument for making [00:30:04] perfect [00:30:07] self determination on my in as you guys doing your survey with you from stuffers you know, maybe the community out there for people to say what they figured out when we first came in, and people who say what's it made on so many people just described themselves how they would? what they see these two remaining and one feel they would felt it so you get now over why that you know, New Zealand base, to YV is something been a runaway of different opinions. Like he's trying to find some commonality with them there. But you need aspects that make him say, this is what makes me when I say I'm queer. Like, for me, for example, most people just assume I'm lesbian, or, you know, normal writer doesn't, I don't particularly care that much. But it's a thing of someone else's queer might be non binary, or someone else might be gay, or, you know, there's, so there's already a multiple number of different within that one word, but another people might have different things around bisexuality or various other. And I think that's where district Councillor mid school, I've had people come, so instead of saying, Hello, I'm today, so I'm a lesbian concerns, but if you know, this, those issues come up. You know, it might be a time when I talk about that. Or not, depending on you know, sometimes it's not appropriate. But I have seen some of those is feeling very isolated. And I was really pleased, they talked to me about it, and I'm just pick up on a roll and then they just start talking Oh, is that as people get the relationship has dropped, that's just the way I go into right as, don't assume, or sometimes people find it very difficult if you come directly at them around sexuality. They can feel quiet and avoid, we've got international students here where it's unsafe in their home countries to be of a different sexual orientation. So that's a way that I find works for me as a [00:32:23] counselor in our history of working with [00:32:27] the database. Prior to that, and again, is the lesbian working in charge of his mental health service was to get all the queer clients came up to me and ice get really shutting with this race of the stuff saying in a ditch cape selves. And this is what you need to do in order to not everyone's going to relate to me just because I'm queer, and I'm all the same, you know, you guys need to find ways of, you know, because I think that there might be a limited results. So paper to me now into chronology, so pretty much cultural, things like that, and not all of them are going to have that range of diversity to be the right person to say, you know, so I'm a great fan of trying to become so that kind of, either my fantasy would be that we didn't even need to have LGBT IQ, that we could just have sex and sexuality and gender diverse and everyone was in there, you know, but that's completely Tyrion because everything's not equal at the moment. So we have to have this to achieve that equality. But I think that's where I'd like to see content, somehow move it self determination, and that can be around all sorts of things race, gender, sexuality. And I'm fortunate to be working alongside Marty doing some research and six in New Zealand and trying to get some change around how things are happening in that arena. And again, that's another here were people feel very [00:34:05] you know, not not, you know, when you talk about not having awareness or people not responding. [00:34:13] So again, it's really tricky, but I'm not in a safe space in the south side. Same thing of you know, you don't want to speak for other people, but you also want to support within the community to inside so much right now, but I guess, trying to find a way because when I was you know, I was coming out as lesbian in the 80s it was completely different and I totally get what you know, the bisexual people are saying of it because it was sort of that sort of make up your mind and they used to be you know, get this becomes an episode show your idea that you really truly and it's been a real goal. It's on stuff ridiculous, you know, fatherless people don't get in their little canes and it's really hard to try and shift them by really want to find a nice while you're presenting all that diversity. Because when I'm talking with doctors, that I only have blinkered binary on my what I'm wanting to hope my research is to shift in from thinking beyond because it's the biggest barrier in my mind, as they think of the binary version. And they just can't, [00:35:22] yeah, get their heads around that [00:35:25] have a way of saying thanks. Until we can shove it in nothing. That's also true in the general population. Like that. Some of the saying in the human rights better that we need to care, we got to get everyone on solid because the people who kind of put up the blocks, you know, [00:35:43] I paraphrase something QCHB earlier, I just want Chiclets Okay, I paraphrase it I just said when describing selves, describe the labels that we are using as well how we would use them as their what why is that okay to that? Yeah. I think I'm [00:35:58] labels as a big [00:36:02] topic to debate on. Some people love them. Some people hate [00:36:06] Exactly. And I think that's something that Yeah, especially within ignored identities as almost as much. Yeah, you know, it's like, [00:36:14] are they empowering? Or are they limiting? [00:36:17] Yeah. So tonight, yes, come alive. [00:36:21] But it's sort of more. Yeah, [00:36:23] I think just like another point that I picked up, that was really awesome. And I totally want to hear from like, everyone else was like, you know, if it like, struck anything with them. [00:36:33] But how you see that you will ask people about the relationship history and not directly like this. [00:36:39] I thought that was really good. And I think sometimes, like in terms of thinking, and just like very small networks, especially, you know, be at friends or people that you meet, and you kind of want to say like, Oh, so you know, like, how's your partner or things like that, you know, you want to find stuff out about the more you want to know, Hey, can I talk to you about this? That that particularly was a really good way of doing it? I'm just wondering why it you know, Does anyone else have any, like, ways that they ask people about that, or even slip it in personally, because I know that sometimes if I'm talking to a young person who I think, you know, might want to have a conversation about something, oh, my ex girlfriend says, I'm the girl really likes that show, you know, and they'll be like, oh, ex girlfriend, you say, you know, and then they'll start talking to you about that. And it wasn't about that it was about you know, some other thing that I made up to try and talk to them about it. But just see, I just sort of thinking about that as well, in terms of it also being like a safe conversation. So, you know, do you personally have any other like, sort of ambiguous questions that you ask? Or [00:37:42] why does kind of you know, so I just say that, what's your support network? Who are you? Who are your friends, you know, just I guess it sort of moving from the N word out, or, you know, any field itself, just generally moving out from there? It's really hard because it's been on the PC in front of me coming. But I guess I always try to just be myself without feeling like I have to tell them everything. But yeah, baby myself and just create a safe environment. And [00:38:19] there's no not a particular phrase as such, but it is [00:38:22] yeah. I think that totally, when you put the focus on yourself, it really makes the other person feel more comfortable. But there's a really fine line to treat along their [00:38:36] professional consumers this is you know, like, [00:38:41] because you can't have all your clients knowing all about you and you can't have your color, you can't be [00:38:49] like, you can't be squashing your clients issues with your own. [00:38:54] It's kind of probably a bit of weirdness, you got to be real rather than necessarily self disclose. Yeah. [00:39:03] Thinking old lady, I don't kind of go in and try and get all the language of all the young folks that are, you know, because I just sort of like straight away, you know, and I've got a Facebook, I have all that stuff. Nice. Now, nearly two different things coming. I'll put that in there for you today. But, you know, so they say I'm, you know, I don't try to be Yeah, what I'm not, you know, so that I think being real is really important. That's not like, you know, as a striker, then. Yeah. [00:39:38] Because I think that was like the main thing. Is this. Also, how do we stop conversations? Which I think is an interesting one. But that's really good. I think, like, as a takeaway. [00:39:50] Good. Anyone else have anything to say in terms of that as well? What time is going to be finishing up [00:39:54] today? Cool. [00:39:57] I don't know. I'm just trying to think as well, in terms of light and action points and things that like, what would actually go into? I don't know what regionals is for you wish were available to you, though, like growing up? Because I think before we even create resources, what resources do we think work? What don't Jeremy like, as a booklet really going to be the most effective thing or in terms of them? [00:40:21] I don't know if this is the right place, or times of [00:40:26] day, but to what [00:40:28] Jason said before about setting goals in Australia. Maybe Italy for myself, is I wish we had that kind of problem in my school when I was in high school. Because [00:40:43] I had first kind of instinct, my [00:40:49] feeling my mind. Yeah, I want guys to come. [00:40:56] Yeah, they came out. So I was about 20 or 30 minutes quick. [00:41:02] So can you tell us or [00:41:08] resources and schools and like school programs. [00:41:14] And some education is basic gender identity, and sexual identity. And I've been quite busy at the moment. So I haven't had a chance to sample showing that clearly. [00:41:30] And more to this lens, [00:41:32] yeah. But like, I have a list of things I want to be taken forward selling with like a Facebook group, then like shift to I want to do a workshop similar to this, but mostly young people's lives, and they know that their identities are valid, because it's something that I think was quite a from this quite invalidating if you don't hear about these things. So balance, but like, as an organization, we're very, like, that's important. We're going to do that. So listen, you know, make sure that we are including the other voices. So [00:42:04] yeah, right. In terms of the results that already exists, do you deliver that like as a workshop? Or are you like, we can all you know, [00:42:13] readily available, [00:42:14] right, and [00:42:19] some online of choice goals can is results that you can download? It hasn't [00:42:26] been the biggest one? Yeah. Yeah. [00:42:31] But I think it's interesting that and it's your points. [00:42:33] But what is going to get kids to access that? [00:42:37] Yeah, because we [00:42:40] really, were the document that's online, some we're actually going [00:42:45] to be related. Some of the things like the trans Resource Center for students, that for teachers to be educated, because the teachers don't know what we're teaching them to. So and it's also about thinking went like, what educate my education classes to issues, but in another class next year, you've got to get my hair at level so that they need to keep doing it like, [00:43:11] you know, yeah. Because I think like, action point that like I personally, like would work towards that, like with my like, political party, personally, like we want is to have it like within the actual, like, serious education curriculum. And making sure that like, as you know, I think it was really NCAA was raised on and 2010, to make sure that we included the Treaty of Litani and like naughty issues, like right throughout the curriculum, whether it was like literally every subject that was integrated into the curriculum. And so I think that would be like, a big vision, my extra point that I think would be cool, like, I don't know, if other people agree with me, like would be cool. It's not as like a community to push. But then it's also such a huge thing, and not necessarily always affected by. [00:44:00] So even though just six, eight, because I found out today that Leonardo da Vinci was gay, because I didn't know that. [00:44:08] Yeah, and so it's like simple things like that. Like, there's actually something quite key and quite important that should be discussed or even just mentioned, when you like learning about these things. [00:44:18] Right? So that's maybe like the end, like you said, something. [00:44:24] Like, you don't talk about like queer writers. Yeah. [00:44:26] There was a conference I went two years ago when I was a lot younger, and with this message discussion about the fact that there's so many people, and like, so many things that are talked about, but you never, ever hear the queer side of things, you know. And so like, you're talking about the French Revolution, but you weren't talking about how it affected like the queer community back then. It was a queer community, then, you know. And so [00:44:51] like, one of the presenters here, yeah, this this evening, or tomorrow night, as has a lecture about [00:44:58] Robin death. [00:45:02] Like a side point in history, I remember learning about it. And just like a one, listen, they're like, Oh, yeah, and I don't like gay people at the site where people very much either really, like that was like, that was that was like, Oh, yeah, they just didn't really like they might try it. And I was like, Okay, why that was all like the extinct of how much it was discussed? [00:45:20] Yeah. So because when you're teaching about those things, and then it's just like validating your identity more, right? And it's just making you feel like, well, as they say, for hundreds of years ago, then that means it's totally meant for me to feel that way. So [00:45:39] when I think the conference that I've said about the inside out resource, is that they are trying to get into all schools at some stats, not they already know, but its staff has a video, and it's been short, sweet. And that's a discussion set of classes. And I think, you know, so the students in the class can talk about stuff. That's really good. And the same with ministry, it's not necessarily a queer thing, per se, but there's a the issue of consent, that being a part of the sex education, you know, that actually, yeah, actually six positivity? Yeah. And that's, that's not actually made a trade for now. I know that I know that they're trying to push that. And that's full conceit, you know, that has to be in the and I think, I was told was home the other day, we said, well, if we go to face speed, in just 10%, of all classes on learning how to be kind and respectful to each other, you know, having sort of, I don't know how you call it. But you know, just as much room, let's gather as for all, it's going, you know, so, and I think that's sort of another against moving it to that wider element, but it's really include all sorts. [00:47:01] Yeah, appreciating difference. And [00:47:03] that's what really interests me, because I don't know, I'm just a bit skeptical, I guess about human nature, especially people growing up, who internalize so much hatred, then that teaching, none of that stuff isn't going to change their thinking, it might be helpful for the people who relate to the what they're learning. I think that's what education can help. I think it can help more people feel accepted, if they are a minority. But I don't think it's able to solve the discrimination actually, [00:47:43] you can kind of say both face. So yeah, what the all of us does, is it creates a safe space for people to their sexuality and gender, because it makes it visible, what's invisible. And examples, I went to bed stand up, I went to one last year, lunchtime at a school where I taught and two years before they didn't have this program. There were 12 or 13 students in that group, including one boy who's that transition to a girl who made that public comment in that lunchtime statement. And so it was just it's given permission to exist. Yeah. [00:48:22] You actually. [00:48:25] Yeah, then then limit that then brings change, because you suddenly have straight students or non [00:48:33] LGBT students who, then now stand up for [00:48:38] a person. Yeah, yeah. And don't allow that that language to still exist. Really? [00:48:43] Yeah. So [00:48:45] I think that's what we saw. [00:48:48] Marriage debate as it actually like, personally, I think it wasn't so much. I mean, it's great for everything you hear. But at the same time, it wasn't so much about that. It was about putting it discussion. To the contrary, you know, like, I became like, we worked on it for a term and social studies. [00:49:05] Visible [00:49:06] Yeah. And it's having that conversation. And then all of a sudden, so many high school students were like, hang on, my parents don't support us. were previously they might not have actually [00:49:19] been taught. [00:49:19] Yeah. And going, like and having those conversations. And like, I know, so many people through that year, myself included, that came out, because all of a sudden, there was this rallying cry, and you could see exactly who it was that was going to be there to support you or perhaps not support you. But you went out there actually are people that if I wanted to talk about this, or even suggest that I might be feeling this way, actually, they are really supportive. [00:49:45] And that's what the education does. Is it actually signposts the safe places. [00:49:51] Because most of us at school, there was no visibility. [00:49:57] discussion. Yeah. In fact, all yours heard was given no role models, so [00:50:03] it was never talked about. Yeah. [00:50:07] Yeah, yeah. [00:50:08] Yeah. role models, I think are quite important as well, like, when I was there were no gay teachers. And like, of course, there were but they obviously didn't feel comfortable being themselves. [00:50:18] Yeah. You heard about everyone like the people have around like, [00:50:23] opposite sex relationships you talk about all the time. Oh, I [00:50:30] had a teacher that perhaps that could have been a role model for me. Especially if [00:50:35] they were teach you that you'd like Yeah. [00:50:39] It was possibly better with my school because there was this teacher who everybody thought was gay, and he was an awful teacher. So people associated that with [00:50:55] my English teacher lesbian, and I have seen in recent years, but they go, she couldn't remember gaining hair once someone says something like, or whatever. And she corrected them. And I remember that there was downtime old high school. But I remember I got you got awards, and I got given the Oscar Wilde compilation. So obviously, they were trying to say, Jason, it's okay. That you are who you are, even though I wasn't out and obviously, I was just writing better that's all I could do. There's nothing there was no right [00:51:30] thing. It is a multi layered education at role models that [00:51:36] love myself after living here, your own son's bar, we started many way to skulking sustainable teachers were saying, you know, they say they will ask what you're doing, and then research around and see them. So then some of those start asking about it. And then they feel this is what my experiences are, usually feel, they have to then say to you that I'm a good person, I, the students and so you know, and it's science, because I'm in a primary school, there were, there was probably nearly a dozen, ever, you know, same six families with children at school, and they, they always talk about mom and dad. So we, we would have to go and have a chat to the school when we united saying what what are you doing to make things a little bit more inclusive? And we talk about parents? And you know, just if we can just a little, too Yeah, just so I think that thing of doing it wherever you can and your own kind of personal life, of course, it's you've got to feel safe to do that as well. I don't want any kind of be a reflection to come back and you can to get tasted bad or any fake but another there was a chocolate came who was talking about his two mothers and the cancer has. Kevin was saying you don't have to man, what are your about That's ridiculous. They had no concept. Right was anything other than having a mild mannered a [00:53:07] little kid, you know, he's only 11 hearing to say, and then one of us, was [00:53:11] it your Kindle? No, no, no, I [00:53:14] have a friend of mine, son. And fortunately, one of his friends who was in the room who has got straight parents [00:53:22] said, No, I've met them. And [00:53:24] yes, he does have two months. And I know other people here that have got two months and they're all like, Oh, hi, Caitlin. And then they just moved on as I don't you know, the same thing of it still though, this is new JR. leavin these trying to break out. You know, and then there's other people who have got, you know, trans children who, you know, so very on the on the ice will know and trying to navigate all that and the school situation. And it's really it's really well, you will not surely difficult, but I think it's a thing of constantly just challenging. We had a parent teacher meeting. So we just talked to Billy what's going on, because we were just we both know that he's embarrassed, fascinating guys, we're going to just expect the teacher to be totally fine with it and to be, you know, sitting and also going to be using language that's inclusive. So that's all we tried, at least all the time. So I said, [00:54:26] Yeah, yeah, names. [00:54:27] Sweet. Yeah, I think the longer you're sort of, I don't know, like, the more you can certainly push things as well, the more people begin to make expected of you as well. And so I remember when I traveled back to Auckland for my sister's birthday, my 13 year old sister was talking to me telling me about something that her friend said, and she said, when I told her mum, what she had said, mum said straightaway arm this is gonna hit that girl, you know, talking about like, her friend was going I'm sure that he just got he saw gay, you know, he's just and my sister was like, you're not allowed to say that. You know? [00:55:02] That's what I mean by Yeah, allows those conversations [00:55:05] Exactly. You know, that like, a few years ago, when I came out to give them she was like, teen at the time, Jeremy. But like she was had completely No idea. She went, does that mean, I'm gay to you know, like, what is what even as like, I always gonna be gay. Are you just like, you know, and she just had zero idea. Whereas now it's such a normal part of her zone that not only is she like, I get it, but she's, like, you know, just standing up for other people as well. Something like a takeaway for everyone is sort of like, I don't know, we're safe, like, have those kinds of conversations or you know, like, extend it to your friends and family. And then that's also like a ripple effect. [00:55:47] Yeah, we bring Andrew OG, Dave, and normalize the two such as more exposure to [00:55:54] the weird labels and a legacy. [00:55:56] Yeah, it's just someone's life. [00:55:59] And I think we [00:56:02] don't want to sound presumptuous, but I think that we've seen the generation filtering. to, to, to the younger generation being far more understanding of, of gay and lesbian, because that's what was happening in 70s. And 80s, was empowering this movement. So that the benefits the following generations, and I think now we're at the stage where we've got these [00:56:34] raised identity, and that's what we need to push. And I think that sounds like bit. I don't know, it's one of those things where I'm not too sure how to fix it. But like, that sounds like really? Sounds really idealistic, doesn't it? We're just gonna fix the world. No, but it's [00:56:50] never women not equal. [00:56:52] Yeah. I've had conversations with my younger sister, and she just spent three and a half, four, when I had this conversation with her and pretty my mom doesn't know that I had this conversation with her. Because I was like, I don't know if she would let me have that conversation with her. But she was saying something to me about, like, facial hair or something. And I don't know, she was talking to me basically, about gender and stuff. And I said to her, Ellie, actually, you know, a woman can have a beard or not everyone is a man or a woman, you know. And so she's just always had that. And I showed her the video of me, but the singer from Europe, you know, yeah, you know what I showed my sister. She was like, okay, you know, cool. She looks like the chick from Atlanta. And I was like, Okay. Um, but it's Yeah, I don't know, like, how we have those conversations. I'm like to say, [00:57:44] I don't know how it's a safe thing to do. [00:57:47] I'm trying to think of an analogy. Yes, safe corner. That's not security related, but could be applied to this. So I can help doctors think about [00:58:01] feeling threatened. [00:58:04] And his friend, Pat, [00:58:06] so scared to talk about six. [00:58:09] But now we're talking about sex or gender as well. [00:58:13] I really like salient point. And [00:58:16] I'm terrible with names. The guy who spoke yesterday, the Italian Oh, [00:58:20] yeah, he had a really good point on his speech that often as well, it's not actually so much about, like, as our identities and people have a problem with is what it says about him and the challenges it could be. And I think that's part of what makes people uncomfortable having those conversations as well as because I think people are sort of like, Oh, well, I don't know anything. I don't know how to have that conversation. And I don't know how to not be offensive. [00:58:45] I've got my weird, settle down. Yeah. Why I don't want [00:58:49] it. And then sort of, I remember anything changed. When I did come out. People ask some really ignorant questions. [00:58:59] But to be honest, like, I would spend like five minutes giving them like an answer, which I totally like, I was like, Oh, you're gonna want to sit down? Like, Oh, I just was asking a quick question. You know, by the time I Yeah, exactly. Tough luck. You've asked me now. By the time I actually finished answering them, they actually said to me, Oh, shit. Sorry. That was a bloody rude question wasn't and I was like, Well, yeah. You know, and they were like, Oh, no, I'm so sorry. And I was like, but like, Yes, that was really hurtful. But at the same time, like that person is now going away. But I also know that, like, I'm definitely not in a situation to do it all the time. You know, and a lot of time, I don't want to entertain like those questions, because I'm like, well, you should know this. And I think that's also what's really hard, as it was mentioned earlier, that, like, we have to educate people, like, I hate to say to my school counselor, who was the person that I was going to for help, like, I had to educate him. You know, and I don't know, I think that's a challenge. And themself, you know, that was a strange tangent, I don't know, pointless. But now, [01:00:04] Does anyone else have like general afflictions or thoughts and feelings, opinions, philosophies, ideas. [01:00:10] We're just going to come in at all angles. And you know, sometimes we'll get right and sometimes be, [01:00:15] right. [01:00:18] That's good that people can feedback. But one of the reasons I came style is coming out of money. I'm already like, done with it. But I, you know, I was really resonated with me when I was saying to you about, you can only have five minutes. Yeah. What was dropping to the end winners you for working in mental health, Charlie Listen, was always a little voice in the head open [01:00:43] to help. And [01:00:48] he just got dropped in at the last minute. So totally felt hornik going on support you and your workshop, and also just hear about these different things. So I don't feel like I know it all, either. And I'm with likely quite a lot of young people here. And I want to be more enlightened about all the different things going on in the community. So [01:01:11] I just want to say thanks for [01:01:13] widen my knowledge already, just from being here today. I think it's really good that stick out for yourself, but it's a pioneer have to do that. [01:01:25] I think also, like, that's just a really good point that maybe in terms of resources as well, like, we don't always need resources for other people, but maybe making resources for each other in terms of like, hey, like, this is how you self care. And this is how like, you look after yourself when you're tired. And maybe that's something that also as a community, we need to look at as looking after each other. Because a few people mentioned that this morning, like being really exhausted, and like, you know, we don't get paid more. I say, Wait, to be honest. Look at people like that as well, who was like, that's the second drop, like you do so much. It's incredible. Like [01:01:59] I said, so I have been really engaging and overtired. Yeah, I'm, like, really glad that this is just sort of turned into a massive discussion. That was kind of the plan. It was like, ways. [01:02:13] The backup plan was that in case the room is full of like old sis white gaming, and we can educate them. But then after wasn't filled with outside gaming. [01:02:37] Think it's also good, though. Like, I think I really appreciate and respect that, like, you're just learning, you know, I'm like running down, like, what is that? What is this like? And that's so important. Yeah, that's one of the most why I watch this really, really good YouTube video, which I was going to try and share today, actually, but I was like, I don't know, if we're going to have resources and stuff with it. I can't remember who does it, I think it's typically or something. But it's a video on how to be an outline. And it's [01:03:06] the arrows that sounds like a lot of work. [01:03:10] I might just post it on like the Facebook page or something if there's a Facebook page, or on Twitter with the hashtag. But it's really good. Because I think sometimes as well, we get so caught up in like, Oh, I'm a part of the community. Like, of course, I'm a great advocate for like everyone else. That actually, like, we almost forget that we still need to learn how to be an error to other people in our community. And one of the big things that she talks about in the video is being able to listen, not like speaking over people, but actually just elevating other people's voice. You know, I think she said something like, like, she had a gift of Macklemore and that part of the video, you know, but actually living like if you, you know, like a really passionate about transitions and stuff actually, like, as a bisexual woman, I can't go out and be like, oh, transitions and transitions that I can be like, whoo, listen to this transparency. I'm talking about the ratios. I'm like, let me you know, elevate this person to talk about their own issues. And so I think it's really awesome network you have come along and just like really listen to my contributed and take another one [01:04:14] more upset with being called Old and [01:04:19] wasn't saying [01:04:24] to take the 45 to 54 age bracket. [01:04:28] I didn't like that. 45 So I was like, Oh, God. [01:04:33] These labels, [01:04:37] say uses categorized is 25 and under [01:04:42] 25 and you're under like 45? And how like what I hear you like a middle you know? [01:04:50] You know, so [01:04:51] I'm always [01:04:53] gonna say I'm Senior you [01:05:00] now you can say your senior us. Just keep it up the whole way through. [01:05:05] And we probably would be in this room without this white gay man. Because [01:05:12] I'm not a trans woman for it. It's done Mormon stuff. So [01:05:16] the movie [01:05:20] seen the movie [01:05:26] and the movie. [01:05:31] And see that lasting woman [01:05:36] is the main person, like who's they cast is this white gay man. And it was like, no. [01:05:46] If I say what's his name, play one more, right? Macklemore? No, no. [01:05:50] What's the guy who was like, in the Danish Girl? And then he was also like Stephen Hawking. [01:05:57] Like, what is your What is your do what I think, [01:06:00] taking on these roles? [01:06:03] And I'm gonna have to see them because they've been fantastic based on where to find them. [01:06:07] I know. [01:06:08] I was. So looking forward to it. [01:06:11] Shall we do a closing around? Yes. Seven minutes, I think we've done really well. [01:06:20] important to know that we're all in this together. No one is should be demeaned. And no one is less valuable. Yeah, respective of their sexuality. So there's no I'm not threatened by a person is different to me. And likewise, people shouldn't be feel that way about myself. You know, and then, you know, whether whether trans people have done great work, gay men and women, intersex persons who are fighting for their rights, you know, doesn't we're all in this together. Nobody's superior, less valuable than the other person. That's really important. Yeah. Sure. Want to be marginalizing. People have gone before us. Yeah. Whatever they, however they define themselves have made it better for us now. Absolutely. Yeah. And we often forget that. Yeah. And it's and when I went to jail, yeah. Totally. [01:07:18] Yeah. There's [01:07:24] nothing more likely to go to jail for [01:07:26] to get a police officer on. [01:07:28] I'm not sure if you were there on Saturday night. [01:07:32] So on Saturday night, 30th anniversary. No. [01:07:39] And but one of the comments, that was very interesting, because a lot of the things that we take for granted, like they're just like, some, not everything goes by law. So a lot of the things that we take for granted could be taken away from us very, very easily. So they will say, we're not going to go to prison. But who knows, like in the next 10 years, Donald Trump is like already, China become president of America, so things could start going [01:08:02] down. Trump is not nearly as bad as if Cruz. I have an anti LGBT Task Force in his team. The values LGBT in the US. And Trump doesn't. I don't want Trump to win. [01:08:19] He does know that he wants to repeal [01:08:22] cause but he's been sort of all over the place. But [01:08:26] the other two nominees are actually worse. [01:08:29] Worse, yes. [01:08:33] Yes. Okay. [01:08:36] Great. And I appreciate it. The one thing here is kind of why we wouldn't have a big turnout, mainly because there's another bisexual thing on at the moment. So sorry. [01:08:49] That you're here. Thank you. [01:09:05] You're beautiful people in the room. [01:09:09] Yeah. And thank you for facilitating. [01:09:16] Yeah, [01:09:18] I think it's been good. I think I have some points to go away with as well. And I hope that it's a conversation that carries on and like that we continue to think about some of the things that we talked about today because I think we've brought up a lot of issues and a lot of things that we're not too sure how to do. And so big right so like it's the sort of set on those episodes about how can we sort of like develop those ideas more? [01:09:44] Hello, goodness. [01:09:46] All the issues are as we [01:09:49] come to this, and was it important to have this [01:09:52] release. I worry that sometimes we pride ourselves too much or snipe at each other. [01:09:57] It's coming from a place that is [01:10:00] of course it is absolutely beautiful. Yeah. Yeah.

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