Kiran and flatmates - Beyond Rainbows

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[00:00:00] This podcast is brought to you by pride and made possible through a generous grant from our tire. Hey, [00:00:08] I'm here in Karen's flat with Cleveland's flatmates. Tell us your flat? [00:00:15] Well, we're a little flat and never know, I tend to refer to it publicly as a safe house, because that's what I set out for it to be. And myself and my partner rent out the house to a bunch of other largely disabled, largely trans queer people. And sometimes I flew to capacity. So some of us actually looking at is it somehow obtaining a second house on the street so that we can, you know, put up more people because there's a real need for safe accommodation for people like us? [00:00:45] What are the some of the issues around safe accommodation that people are needing? [00:00:51] Because the housing crisis in Oakland right now. So that's massive me like queer and trans youth already have like a really, really hard time finding safe housing, right. And when you've got a housing crisis that just amplifies that issue, like, you know, tenfold essentially, it's very, very difficult to find flatmates that you will be safe with, it's very difficult to find a house to begin with. So when 100 people turn up for a flat view, and they're not going to pick the ragtag quiz, exactly. [00:01:23] Right, a quiz, [00:01:24] four of us will fly hunting for a significant amount of time. And it was difficult enough finding people who were remotely willing to accept people who are students. And even though not all of us are students, at least one of us was working, people are still like, no, you're too young, or your students. And if I showed up a flat viewing, so long as I visibly queer around person, they literally will not trust that I had the authority to speak on behalf of my potential flatmates. If I showed up with one of the others were all you know, also really visibly queer looking, they just be like, okay, no, this is going to be a house of degenerates, we can't relate to you. And as a result, several of us were, you know, like, didn't have a place to live for very long time. [00:02:01] So what else is your pick it up? So apart from the safe housing, you know, activities? Oh, yeah. So we're looking at something on the wall [00:02:10] with a variety of flats, main drinking game rules. [00:02:16] safe housing and drinking. [00:02:19] You know, like this, that's part of it. Like, it's like part of safe housing stuff is that so many of us have, you know, PTSD or other trauma stuff going on. And I'm not going to say that drinking games are specifically a trauma coping mechanism. But also, I'm going to say that they kind of are. And in general, like safe spaces, even for even space as a explicitly meant to be safe for queer and trans people don't often accommodate survivors, particularly well, especially not people who are, you know, most of us are autistic, or have some other sort of censorship going on, or some sort of anxiety? And, like, Am I supposed to be swearing this much? [00:02:54] I think it's all right. [00:02:55] Okay. And and it's really difficult to find, you know, even straight white allies who are comfortable with, man, you guys are weird enough with your, you know, like, same sex relationship. [00:03:13] So you, you touched on some things that sounds like it's not really covered by, you know, for one of the beta to mainstream gay rights, activism or campaigning or whatever, some of it being housing issues, safer, safer spaces and safer housing for queer and trans young people as well as like, mental health stuff. And survivors such as them. Yeah. What do you want? I mean, it's kind of obvious why it's not covered. But what are some reasons or tensions about mainstream gay rights stuff not covering all of us? [00:03:49] It's too much work. And they don't care? Yeah. [00:03:53] Like, I mean, they've got this, why do they bother bother with people like us, like, I mean, primarily, like any sort of movement towards acceptance towards inclusion is about saying, Hey, we want to be equal to our oppressors, we want to have that power to Yeah. And they have that power, they have that power of a quiz, like us, they have that power in the sense that, you know, they can still very much as exclude us from spaces, which I have stepped up in which, you know, they are equal to each other. It's like, congrats, you know, you have the right to form nuclear families recognized by the state as marriage. Like, if you fit into that model, and if you have enough money to pay for a wedding, and if you have, you know, like, how many of us are ever going to? [00:04:38] Yeah, at some point, like, everything gets simplified, like, all of this stuff gets simplified to capital. And that includes like, cultural capital, social capital, like financial resources, everything. And if you're like, like, your only access of repression is that you're, you're gay or whatever. It's like, you're going to side with capital, you're going to do whatever you can add part of having that means scoring over the people below you. That's how it works, because [00:05:04] you benefit from so much of it. Like I think part of the reason why white gay men tend to be so outraged by being mistreated, and by homophobic violence and stuff like that is because by all rights, they should have access to what white straight men do, by all rights, they should be able to, you know, trade over women and trade over other minorities, but they but you know, on some some access, you know, hey, they actually getting bullied, right? And oh, my God, oh, my God, that is unacceptable. Why don't we have everything that we should have coming to us? And nothing else matters? Because, you know, you still have that power used to get to call other people, you know, politically correct. You get to call people like social justice warriors, because, you know, I'm just a regular old guy who lives in Ponsonby. And you know, like, all I want to do is enter landscaping competitions. And you know, go walk seven dogs, my husband, and be perfectly respectable and palatable to the other heterosexuals in Ponsonby. Yeah, [00:05:56] yeah. So, would you say that the there's definitely some tension with how, I don't know, for one of the big teams, that stuff that isn't covered by mainstream media, and the and how that is represented when it is covered by mainstream media. [00:06:12] They tend to lose things from covering it. So they don't. People like underrate them [00:06:16] if they talk about us, because we're not happy stories. Yeah, [00:06:19] like I mean, right. Oh, boy, [00:06:25] earlier than I expected to get into this. Oh, yeah. Well, contacts are flat is basically full of activists. But that's mostly because, you know, we don't we stop yelling about our lives. And literally, no one will give us anything we can survive on will die. [00:06:36] Yes, yellow die, and shut [00:06:39] up. How's it been received? Has anybody picked up on that? Or is it just been largely ignored, or [00:06:45] it's been picked up in the most curious [00:06:46] of ways. And that, like, for example, I got interviewed for an American like rainbow website. And like nobody in music when he wants to talk to me. [00:06:59] Who wants to, like, criticize us as much as I possibly can? And like, [00:07:03] I mean, Jen, literally just got mentioned my family first. [00:07:09] Yeah. Does he want to do a little background on what just happened with family first. [00:07:15] So I'm Stetsons it just released the new standard for noting gender identity, which had some problems in that it lists like anything that isn't like system, Allah says female and like in other section. So I wrote a post about that. And Family First of just like something an article saying that it's a very confusing standard, and it should just be set to like objective reality, which is male and female, and that even people like me, like gender activists are never going to be happy with it. Because we're criticizing it as well. One of the agenda activists. [00:07:48] Yeah. And it's like, they, like, it's not that hard to get it, right. But they don't really stand everything to gain. It's seen as a waste of resources to accommodate trends people, like, and it's sad. Like, we're literally in the LGBT, I'm like, we're in the most famous acronym for it. And we're still not like, it's still seen as like, and bonus, if we're even, like, treated even slightly correct. Like this the scene, like having an other section is seen as a step forward. [00:08:18] Right? Yeah. And I mean, we had like, there was a long, long public discussion, like sex and attempted to engage us. And there were a lot of us putting time and effort into that. And we were getting yelled at by people who are like, excuse me, okay. No, I, my agents heard the word says gender like, I'm sorry, but we're all just straight with straight, like, [00:08:37] many people, and only one of them knew what it was and put up in the dictionary and said it meant being on the side of a mountain. [00:08:48] It's like, okay, you obviously know, jack. All right. And you think your opinion matters. And in fact, you feel entitled to your opinion mattering as much as if not more than us? Because you represent the majority. And the people who might be confused by the sensors matter more than the people who are absolutely outright being, you know, [00:09:04] thrown on the side of the road. The thing that annoys me is that they have like 12 pages of explanation of what all the words mean, and what to take for why at the start of the census. So confusion isn't a valid reason for not including it. Yeah. Yeah. [00:09:16] What would you say some of the, I don't know, the impacts of, I guess, especially being, you know, tacked on in the end or marginalized within the wider LGBT movement. Now, how does it impact materially or in reality kind of thing. [00:09:33] Basically, [00:09:34] as far as like that, like mainstream gay movement is concerned, right now, it's not like Paul driving our way towards marriage equality, then it's not worth [00:09:43] the states with all of the money. Like, as soon as marriage equality, like went through, the Supreme Court's all of the money is starting to dry up from all of the organizations and no one's going to be able to use that for trans things or anything else. [00:09:54] We've got marriage, like what now? Like, obviously, the gays are equal, you know, like, there's no, there's no homeless trans youth. There's no, you know, like, queer people of color being assaulted on the streets, you know, like, equality. Right? Okay. [00:10:07] Even what marriage means to different people as well, like, marriage isn't necessarily an accessible institution for a lot of people. Right? It's it's marriage, it's for those like, people who already have access to capital, who already have access to the power, essentially, for white middle class gays. And everybody else just gets trampled or toss beside. [00:10:27] Yeah, it's not like marriage is not really a coherent thing for anyone in this house. Like, it's easy. [00:10:37] But your your marriage is not going to be a very, like, it's not going to be [00:10:45] the average for a wedding, apparently, which, you know, holy shit. I haven't never had like, holy shit, like, I'm the person who pays the rent, and like, mostly, you know, like, sort of expenses and stuff. And I have any shortfalls, anyone else, and I don't, I don't know what I would do with it. [00:11:04] That's, that's a lot of [00:11:06] surgery that you have to wait 40 years to get. [00:11:08] Yeah. [00:11:10] And, you know, Jim's been fundraising and ship, but like, you know, like, there are people out there who can just blow all of that and be like, you know, I want my dream wedding. And I'm going to have it and how is that? How is that reality? Anything to do with us? It's like, you know, the only thing stopping me from having my wedding, you know, it's not the $36,000. It's the fact that, you know, the state hasn't made it legal for me to have an excuse to throw this massive party where I get to fly. [00:11:33] Yeah, I just want to say like, like, for context, my benefit just went up from 142 to 15 per week, and I got very, very, very, very excited. So that's the difference that you're looking at here. Yeah, yeah. And it's still just barely enough to keep me like, alive and fit. [00:11:51] Like some white sustains like, ran like a Kickstarter for the winning, they'd get money so much, rather than any trans woman was. [00:11:57] Like, that should be a bad indicator. [00:11:59] Not a good one, which is how to take it. Yeah. People people want to hear happy stories. That's love wins on the narrative. [00:12:06] Yeah, we don't mean like, it's lazy, it's, you know, we want to tell people, it gets better. Because if we tell them, you know, I'm sorry, the system is fighting against you, then we actually have to change things, we actually have to make something that's not empty promises for our youth. And that's all we've any of us have ever gotten is empty promises. You know, we're sitting here and we've been like, we've been multiplying marginalized, and no one is accommodating any of our needs. And the only people we have is each other. And we've been so fucked up by society. And by the different ways we've been treated, that we're always we can't even trust each other properly, and was terrified of each other we all we have, you know, and and you can't give us and it gets better story. We're not going to believe that and the end because we are willing to take part in this happy feel good making, you know, because we're not going to smile and walk in the parade and be like, Hey, you know what life is good for me because Oakland has a parade because rainbows are allowed because I'm wearing this, you know, right patch on my jacket. And it means that people slapped me on the back and congratulating me instead of yelling slurs at me in the street. A guy spent on me after the after the pride in 2014 I was sitting on the side of the road me spam me. And a whole bunch of people yell at us, even when we do the walk in the parade. And we say hey, you know, maybe I'll try to celebrate with you for this one goddamn day. And maybe you'll have my back for one as I got them Day this year, when I asked you to feed me. They don't. [00:13:32] Yeah, a lot of the time, like, the best way that we like, like, because we do get a lot of donate donuts and stuff like to like food and money on occasion. And we're very grateful. But like, a lot of the time we like we we sell it, we sell it by like framing it around like hey, help these queer kids. Look, marriage equality just got out. [00:13:52] Yeah, like I raised, I raised the most money I've ever raised for this lately, I got us groceries for a month by saying hey, marriage equality just popped to celebrate, you can help us get food. And it's like, none of us, none of us actually give a shit about marriage. Oh my God, if anything, and in we want to stop hearing about it, because all these like people who think they're good allies who have literally yelled at us or refuse to support us on my agenda, suddenly have rainbow filters on their Facebook profile pictures. And you know, [00:14:23] I've got impact of connections down here as an artist, but I can't remember. [00:14:29] When you live in the life where you have to like scream and yell for every like little bit you can get your relationship with like the people in the community obviously is going to hit like dirt area to the point where you can't really feel that you can go to those organizations for help. Like, when like the people who are like in them and running them people you have like fault with online of like, issues of like your rights and your safety, then you can't feel like the communities are safe. It's like a safe space for you. [00:14:56] Right? Yeah. I mean, like, I'll friend me has talked about this repeatedly. And like the fact that, you know, she's been constantly going on and on about how you know, there is massive, massive injustice in the prison industrial system, especially for trans women of color. And no one has listened to her no one cares. And, like, what are we supposed to do, and no one wants to hear our stories because they are unfair. And also, quite frankly, they can't be bothered. It's not happening to anyone who remotely, they can remotely relate to. So why does it matter? You know, we look funny, we act funny, we talk funny, our priorities are different. And because most of us are really fucking autistic, you know, like, we literally don't, we aren't human, basically, we have we can't connect with and we don't have this emotional capacity to engage with the world because we're so mistreated, that, you know, we kind of have to shut down to keep ourselves safe. I mean, even [00:15:43] the Department of Corrections ignored, like three different official Information Act requests about like the state of like trans prisons, and how many they were like where they were, and they just like, ignore them, because they know that there's no going to be big. There's no big like, media uprising or like backlash. No one it's not going to get it's not going to be a big story. It's just, like maybe a footnote on like, gains it or something. But definitely not like one or three or anything. Yeah, yeah. [00:16:09] Yeah. And I mean, like we were at, um, well, I am some of the others where an event hosted at the university, talking about live more in Pacifica queer stories. And representative of one of the major gay media organizations was there and just said, You know, I don't get it if you'd like, to me again, you know, I don't get it. If you're, if you're, you know, so lacking and resources like I will, you know, I was talking to the dude at the time, because he was just asking him Why Why don't we reach out? Why don't we ask for help? And I'm saying, you know, we do. We do, and there is nothing set up to help us because no one knows that we exist. And when they know we exist, they don't really want to help us. Yeah, and he went, I don't get it. Like, I mean, truly, you know, the mainstream gay community will be willing to help you like, just because like, other things aren't set up already. Why don't you just apply for like the Gay Men's Health Network? And it's like, because [00:17:02] because I'm not a gay man. [00:17:06] A man are we supposed to pretend to be something we're not always supposed to pretend to be something that we've been cohesively, like in the case of trans woman, you know, and I'm not speaking as a way here, like, do weekly, I'm not moving. But like, are we supposed to be things were not in order to get help? Like, is that to constitute a really reasonable life when things that we want to get housing? [00:17:25] Yeah. And I think it's also like, like, it's very important, like most like, even the things that I set up to help us don't really acknowledge, like, any reality, except that we attract, like, off this house, like everyone here has like, like, everyone except one in this house is autistic. There's like PTSD, there's, they're like, we're we're very, like mentally ill. [00:17:53] It's very, it's a really, really, really big part of being trans is just like trauma make it gets mentally ill. That's because of the way that the mainstream was treating us. It's like, you know, like, we got, like, you know, maybe the Born This Way We Were authority doesn't work for those of us who are made this way, by the way you fucking treated us. Yeah, we can't [00:18:12] get back who we were. And like, we it's makes it even harder to ask for help. Because we're too weird. We act too weird. We need too much space to ourselves. We like our weed. We're not emotive enough. In our speaking we can't speak formally. We don't understand how to control our tone. Like we asked [00:18:28] for help. But we sound like we don't deserve it. [00:18:30] Yeah, we're like, convenient. That's what it comes down to. Yeah, [00:18:34] we're not respectable enough. We need to Yeah, we're too much if we take up too much space, if we even try out a little bit of space on the [00:18:42] deserving porn as the undeserving DN unfortunately, [00:18:45] weird queer, trans. [00:18:49] Yeah, yeah, save names, like a, I guess, a multitude of essentially structural and social oppressions and intersections, and live on the kind of intersections of a whole bunch of things. What are some of the ways in which you? I don't know, I guess, resist or survive? Like, what are the things he some of you don't personally or collectively? I'm in this house differently? Sounds like it's an important part of their [00:19:16] Yeah, I mean, I've said this before, but really, all we have is each other a lot of the time and like, and that's, that's really true to like, a really, really big extent and very scary extent, because it's like, even if we find other people who share the same things we do, you know, I'd say we're in the same way we are, who are queer and trans in the same way we are, like, we don't know if there was people who aren't who, who benefit from power, and who might, you know, who, whose involvement with the people. We know, my legal ramifications for us, okay, community is complex as hell. And too many people, you know, aren't aware that, you know, they're hanging out with little rapists, or they're hanging out with people who are white supremacists. Or, you know, and like, it's like, I can't go to most events, even ones that are you know, explicitly trans focused, or explicitly, you know, meant for, you know, literally Asian queers or whatever, without without running into someone who hasn't been one of my friends. Yeah. [00:20:10] There's like that, even in a big ass, like city like Auckland. Like it's very, very hard. Like, everyone knows everyone in the queer community, you're one or two degrees away, like, even if even here, like, all of us are one or two degrees of separation from abusers, and rapists. And yeah, like, so we end up seeming really, really insular. Because we can only trust like maybe eight people in this community. Yeah. [00:20:41] Would you say that? The space that you've created here is like it's like a hub so that other people can find each other? [00:20:51] Yeah, absolutely. Like we have people who travels through who are from other parts of the country, and in December from other countries who come through and stop and stay with us for a little bit. And like, you know, check in, like, have a little breathing space here. We have people who know me on Tumblr where I run and used to run much more actively a blog for gender questioning teenagers, like and, you know, people who are like, Hey, you know, I live in Oakland, too. I really need a space where I'm not going to get misty eyed. Can I come hang for a day? Can I come sleep over tonight? Hi. You know, I don't I don't know where I'm going to sleep tonight. Can I come sleep at your place? And it's like, sure we have a spare bed, which in our room, you can come sleep with us? [00:21:32] You know, and people living in bedroom set and most nights there's at least seven people here if not like [00:21:38] I think our record was 12. Yeah, yeah. Like sometimes we have two people here. It's a four bedroom house with one toilet. [00:21:44] And like not very much hot water. [00:21:48] Like we have, we have a fun time literally trying to get anything done. The shower doesn't work. like half the stove doesn't work. But like, we get by, we get by and like we have skipped by because, like, you know what, what can we do to help other people? It's like, Okay, look, there are currently eight people in the house. Someone else doesn't have some way to sleep tonight. Of course, they can sleep on our floor. [00:22:08] Yeah. Yeah. [00:22:12] And Alia said already, like, it's really important to note that, you know, we're all like, we all need a lot of space to ourselves. But we all do what we can when other people need space, because you know, we only have what we have. something is better than nothing. And sometimes we have to make compromises. Yeah. [00:22:29] Hopefully we can fix that with the second house though. [00:22:31] Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, me and me and my partner here. I'm the one UK with being named. No. Yeah. Okay. Yeah, we sleep. Um, like we sleep in the lounge together. We don't have a room because it's, it's a four bedroom house and keys with their partner. And, like so. And I'm fine with that. But like having a second house because I'm very artistic and often get very overstimulated, because this is the common way [00:22:57] constantly tracking through the space where you sleep. [00:23:00] Yeah. And having a second house means like, we not only can help more people, like we're [00:23:06] equipped to help people because like, basically all of us are heavily involved with activism of some sort with reaching out to support, you know, some things that we all have different. We play different roles, we have different interests, we reach out to different groups, but we aren't going to be able to do that we are constantly burnt out from you know, trying to look after ourselves. But sometimes, that's the piece we can manage. [00:23:29] What is some of the relationships like with other groups and other people that you've reached out with? The Yeah, [00:23:38] hello. stagers turned out shit. [00:23:39] Yeah, a lot of people tend to regard us with a sort of weariness. Like they, they don't trust us. They think we've got something up our sleeves, they think we've got something planned, there's some sort of, you know, hostile takeover or something that's bigger than just, you know, surviving, I think is like, they don't believe what I understand about like, the whole the struggle, they think that you just have all this time on your hands to like dual dispatch it when in reality, you're just trying to live. [00:24:05] And like they like what are they doing with all of that time? Why do they need all that time to like, cook and clean? [00:24:11] Yeah, we were like, we're all disabled in some way. And, like, even like doing the dishes, or like vacuuming like will take up an entire day, if only because, like it like it takes up all our energy. And then all we can do from then on is the rest, like a lot of our time is spent not doing anything because that's all we can do. [00:24:31] And I mean, as activists like that makes us you know, between juggling, you know, the literal perfunctory tasks of staying alive and juggling what everyone else expects of us in terms of you know, just literally just keeping us alive, we have to do all this activism and then people want to talk to us with the media wants to contact us and we have to deal with all this press for like all this public fallout from people talking about us and people trying to talk to us when we barely have enough energy to talk to each other to make sure we have more the fucking [00:25:05] sounds like Well, obviously, you know, there's a whole bunch of negative crap surrounding lots of different aspects of your identities, my mental health and around just just whole bunch of stuff. Really, what are some of the ways you know, how have you personally [00:25:25] worked through all that crap? That's actually really [00:25:31] good because like, it's the it's the mainstream gay show. So like, we can watch it and like, see what these people are really like? [00:25:39] Hey, you know, this is all really familiar to us, but it has no ramifications on us because none of these people are gonna jump out of the screen and actually, you know, beat us up. [00:25:47] Yeah, it's we made a habit of just like semi semi ironically watching, like Glee and other like bad shows. And just like, like, relating to them really hard while also like, like, understanding and like making fun of all this shit. Because these shows they're really really racist. [00:26:08] Like, the only safe way to relate to the mainstream gay thing is through like, through the TV laughing at them. Yeah. [00:26:14] Yeah, and there's not even like good laughter is anxious laughter is Oh my god, these relationships are so unhealthy and remind me of relationships I've been in in the past when I felt I was says [00:26:24] Jesus Christ. Yeah. [00:26:25] Oh my god. This is so painful to watch. It's so real. Yeah. [00:26:29] And the thing is, is meant to be playful. laughs It's meant to be just [00:26:33] yeah, it's our lives. This is literally our lives. You know? Like, I'm like, people will look at it and go oh my god, there's like drama every single episode and like, new people are trying to destroy this group of people every single episode. It's like, wow, yeah, yeah. Yeah. [00:26:47] Yeah. [00:26:50] Like a lot of like, this is more of just like people not believing that we exist, or that we struggle this much like, like reviews and stuff. This is the thing like any kind kind of music or tea or TV shows or anything about trans people, queer people, like will always be like, it's not relatable, like no one actually has this many struggles like, and we do. Like [00:27:15] the sisters will review trans gender dysphoria. [00:27:19] album is not relatable for you. Oh, [00:27:23] yeah. Not punk because it's not relatable. [00:27:26] Yeah. My, um, when I was still living at home, my dad my dad stopped watching artists and new black because he founded unrealistic because he thought there's no way prisons can be this bad. And by all accounts, so much worse. Yeah. [00:27:46] Yeah, and one of our friends had a relative share Facebook meme about like how we should we should totally have old people put in prisons and prisoners in, in senior care centers, because prisons totally look up to people way better than senior kissing does not like [00:28:04] to be in prison. [00:28:07] And also [00:28:09] totally white middle class and like, you have never thought about a prison for a day in your life other than us taxpayer money being wasted. Not just [00:28:19] being wasted but being wasted what they see is like a luxury for things like hot showers and like power and food. [00:28:28] accommodation [00:28:31] in a shitty place. [00:28:33] It's your fault. [00:28:35] Yeah, and it's like, you know, we like like, really, like, why it's just need to shut the fuck up about blaming us for bit of problems. Honestly, like, if you if you if you can't be bothered if you're so individualist and capitalists that you can't be bothered looking after your grandparents or like you don't have the facility to look after your grandparents or whatever the hell like that's an existing structures don't do that without kind of exploiting you. Or, or your or your relatives that's not on the people who are going to die on the people who are going to jail, on the people who you know, have different sort of family ethos in you, or whatever the hell [00:29:07] like if it was really that much better old people would just commit crimes and go to jail. [00:29:11] Yeah, [00:29:12] like old people aren't dumb. They go to jail. Yeah. [00:29:17] I mean, like, why not? [00:29:23] Yeah, if we all go to jail, then the overflow and I have to go to jail. This is how we have an industrial complex. [00:29:31] This is the big thing that we've been planning what all the spare time. [00:29:39] Go just to wrap up, it really kind of last things that you want to say, whoever to whoever's potentially listening or to other people who might be struggling and surviving in the same way that you all are. [00:29:53] If you have money, give us it if you don't come hang out with us. [00:30:01] That's pretty much it. You know, like, you're not alone. [00:30:06] You're not alone. And the world is more and more terrifying than you have possibly imagined. Even if you're already depressed, I promise you. You're not alone. And I'm not going to tell you that it gets better but you'll find some way something will happen. You'll run into a bunch of drag queens and it will terrify people at the bus stop waiting for the bus and [00:30:25] it doesn't get better but you find other people for whom it also does not get better. [00:30:28] And you guys are all together.

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